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CTIY COUNCIL PROCEEDINGS ARE AUDIO AND VIDEO TAPE RECORDED AND ON FILE
IN THE OffiCE OF THE CTIY CLERK
MINUTES
CTIY COUNCIL OF THE CTIY OF ARCADIA
and the
ARCADIA REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
JULY 15,1997
The City Council and the Arcadia Redevelopment Agency met in a Regular Meeting on
Tuesday, July IS, 1997 at 6:00 p,m. in the Council Chambers Conference Room.
ROLL CALL
PRESENT: Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
ABSENT: None
L
AUDIENCE PARTICIPATION
06 S'o - 0.2/3 John Nobrelm. John's Discount Golf Shop, 28112 East Huntington Drive, residing at 326
North Oakcliff Road, Monrovia. stated in pari. that the Downtown 2000 project, which
was to be completed in six months, actually took one and one-half years and he lost over
$73,000 in business because of the project. His business is one of the few left in the area.
Other business' left because there is not sufficient parking available on the south side of
Huntington Drive in the downtown area between Santa Anita and First Avenue,
Originally there were thirty-one (31) parking spaces on the south side, now there are ten
(10), He believes parking enforcement has not occurred since the project began. The
remaining parking spaces are taken by bar patrons who park on Huntington Drive all
day, Customers for his golf shop complain about the parking on Huntington and will not
park in the back parking lot or drive down the alley because they are afraid to park there,
He believes also that some of the street planters on the south side of Huntington are too
large and feels several of the smaller island planters could be removed to provide
additional parking and the large planter in front of his shop could be reduced.
In reference to the proposed Farmers Market on First Avenue, he would object if the alley
in back of his shop were to be closed off for this event ,If left open he does not want
customers for the Farmers Market parking in spaces for his customers, he would then be
the loser. Mr. Nobrega noted other losses he has taken in his business with bad checks
and a break-in, which the Police Department has not solved He is trying to stay in
business and is asking Council to do something about the parking on the southside of
Huntington which will attract other business people to the area
,I,
2,
DOWNTOWN Consideration and discussion of the July IS, 1997 staff report regarding: I) The
LAND USE, DEV, Central Business District (CBD) Zone; 2) First Avenue retail versus Huntington Drive
STANDARDS! retai1Iservices (permitted uses); 3) Design issues - Downtown and Citywide; 4) Land use
PROMOTION - Arcadia Business Association request for a moratorium on beauty/nail salons; 5)
ACfIVITIES Downtown Arcadia Questionnaire results; and, 6) Other issues affecting Downtown
o 6 .10 _ ~_- Arcadia.
(J(; ill - {I,)/,:" The Community Development Administrator, Donna Butler, presented an overview of
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the CBD regulations previously adopted by the City Council to promote a strong
pedestrian retail center and to create an historic downtown area. The CBD regulations
require retail uses along Huntington Drive and First Avenue in one-third (1/3) of first I
floor areas of business establishments. Ms. Butler noted business uses along Huntington
Drive are starting to change and the City's facade rehabilitation program bas been fairly
successful. It bas only been one and a half years since the CBD requirements were put in
place in the downtown area and given time the long-term vision for the area will result
from the program. Ms. Butler reiterated the pwpose of the CBD regulations was to
promote retail use within the downtown area. The issue of Huntington Drive retail
versus First Avenue retail was noted; First Avenue appears to be a more pedestrian
oriented area because of the friendly environment created by the angled parking.
landscaping. the decrease from four lanes of traffic to two lanes which slowed the traffic
down through the area, and the perception of a safer environment for pedestrians and
shoppers,
Ms. Butler noted the redesign of Huntington Drive bas had a positive effect on the image
of the street, however, it is still a major arterial. The median strip in the center of
Huntington creates a different environment than a typical downtOwn area. Currently,
there are many existing service oriented businesses along Huntington Drive.
Staff requested Council direction regarding the CBD zoning regulations and how they
relate to the accomplishment of retail uses along Huntington Drive and First Avenue, and
whether to re-focus efforts to establish such uses in these areas.
Considerable discussion ensued related to business uses in the CBD zone. Ms. Butler
noted in the year and one-half since the Downtown area bas been marketed there bas
been a turnover in the business' in the area; Claro's bas expanded their business;
prospective tenants are very serious to locate at 141 East Huntington; other bnsiness' are I
looking into the "Better Gardens" site, Ms. Butler noted also'that the Landmark Center
in the 400 block of Huntington bas only two vacancies left... the T ':lndm.rk owner
attnbutes this to the economy and the improvements along Huntington Drive. The
Mayor remarked he sees restaurants and other business coming into the area, but not
retail business, Ms. Butler reiterated that it would take a lot more time to bring business
to the area and it is not known what the perfect combination is to do that
In the discussion the matter of parking spaces along Huntington Drive in the downtown
area was considered. In June, 1997 a Downtown Arcadia Questionnaire was sent to all
merchants and property owners requesting input on issues affecting downtown. The
results of the questionnaire indicate that downtown merchants and property owners are
generally satisfied with the Downtown 2000 Streetscape, including the parking design;
sixtY-six (66) of those responding indicated they wanted "no changes" to the landscaping
as it currently exists. In addition, the majority of merchants prefer a two (2) hour
parking restriction on Huntington and First Avenue.
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Based upon the survey results it was the opinion of the Community Development
Administrator that Mr. Nobrega's problem is one of location rather than parking,.. there
is a large planter in front of his business. Staff believes that marking the parking spaces
along Huntington would be helpM. In response to Mayor Harllicht, Mr. Nobrega
commented that his parking problem could be solved if the sma1ler planteIS were
eliminated and the larger planter in front of his business reduced on both sides. Also, he
maintained that the police department was not enforcing the two-hour parking limit In
addition, he feels that the parking limit should be 90 minutes. CounciJmember Young
noted she bas driven past Mr. Nobrega's location pwposely in the past three weeks about
one or two times a day and bas seen empty parking spaces every time, Mr. Nobrega
responded that he cannot predict when he is going to be busy.
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In reference to the parking enforcement issue, the City Manager noted the City bas to put
up additional signage for the two hour parking limit which will be readily visible, and
then enforce it
Garland Roberson, representing the Arcadia Business Association, commented that
employers of the businesses in downtown should require that their employees park in
other areas away from their place of business, This should be enforced by the business
people.
Councilmember Kuhn said she was very frustrated at this point because she had
absolutely no input in the Downtown 2000 project because of a conflict of interest in the
redevelopment area Now, just a short time later, Council is thinking of spending
additional money to tear out what was just put in. Two or three additional parking
spaces are not the answer... a long term parking answer is needed if Council intends to
try and install retail business in Huntington Drive. Counci1member Young agreed that it
is not the time to tear out planters. Restriping, putting up more parking signs and
enforcing the parking limit is a better way to go. The downtown project area needs to be
given more time to succeed.
Councilmember Chang felt the parking situation should be further studied by staff to see
whether it could be improved.
Mayor Pro tern Kovacic commented that the parking spaces should be striped and the
two hour parking limit enforced and see how this works... if nol, then remove some
planters, if that is a reasonable solution.
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Mayor Harbicht noted that Council bas a consensus to direct staff to mark the parking
spaces and enforce the two hour parking limit
City Manger Kelly stated in part, that the genesis of downtown is changing... it takes ten
(10) years to recycle, Monrovia took ten years to change the use of its downtown area
He did the Burbank downtown project. The theaters and restaurnnts made that project
work... then retail business came in. Huntington Drive is not a downtown streeL First
Avenue is such a street Restricting retail on Huntington may be a mistake. It's a service
related streeL If Council, wants retail on First Avenue, focus retail there and allow
service and retail on Huntington. To make downtown successful, means waiting for the
tide to change. It will take awhile, Staff will start with the parking changes.
Mayor Harbicht suggested that Councilmembers, Planning Commissioners, business
people and anyone else interested, meet on a Saturday morning on Huntington Drive and
walk through the entire downtown area and familiarize themselves with the area and
look at what is going on. Then Council could decide some things that it would like the
Planning Commission to consider and then make some recommendations back to the
Council.
Mayor Pro tern Kovacic thought this to be a great idea and, in the future he would like to
expand this to every business district in the city.
Councilmember Chang said Council should let the merchants know when this tour will
take place, so Council can speak with them along the way,
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The City Manager said he would check the Council's calendar for a Saturday date
sometime in August.
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INVOCATION
PLEDGE OF
ALLEGIANCE
ROLL CALL
4.
OATIl OF OFFICE
(Barrows - Rec.
Commission)
O/~()-6l)
5,
6.
CHANG
(Agenda lOa.)
(Agenda lad)
ORD, & RES. READ
BY TITLE ONLY
7.
7a
PUB, HRG.
3'l,OI62'
CLOSED SESSIONS
At 6:53 p,m, the City Council RECESSED to the Closed Sessions,
Punruant to Government Code Section 54956.9(a) to confer regarding the brisling
workers' compensation case of Nancy Sexton v. City of Arcadia
Ana, pursuant to Government Code Section 54957.6 to confer with City labor negotiators
Dan Cassidy and/or Gary Rogers, regarding negotiations with all represented and
unrepresented employees.
At 7:00 porn, the Closed Session ended and the Regular Meeting of the City Council
RECONVENED in the City Council Chambers,
Rev. Sid Sybenga, Arcadia Christian Reformed Church
Fire Chief Ken Lavoie
PRESENT: Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
ABSENT: None
PRESENTATION
The City Clerk administered the oath of Office to James Barrows, incoming
COmmissioner to the Recreation and Parks Commission. Mayor Harbicht welcomed
COmmissioner Barrows to the City family, Councilmember Kuhn, Council liaison to the
Recreation Commission, welcomed Commissioner Barrows and presented him with City
credentials and a City pin.
SuPPLEMENTAL INFORMATION FROM STAFF REGARDING AGENDA ITEMS
None
QUESTIONS FROM CITY COUNCIUREDEVELOPMENT AGENCY REGARDING
AGENDA ITEMS
Councilmember Chang pointed out a correction to the minutes of the June 17, 1997
meeting,
Councilmember Chang asked for clarification of Consent Item lad.. the bid from
, Schlumberger Industries, Inc. for purchase of Water meters under the fiISl option year.
The bid from Schlumberger was $68,748, City staff recommends that Council award a
contract in the amount of $100,000. The City Manager noted the appropriation of
$HlO,OOO allows staff the flexibility to increase the amount of water meters on an as
needed basis at the low bid price,
It was MOVED by Councilrnember Young, seconded by Councilmember Kuhn and
CARRIED that ordinances and resolutions be read by title only and that the reading in
full be WAIVED.
PUBLIC HEARINGS
COnsideration of Zone Change 97-001 to add a high rise overlay to the C-2 zoned
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Zoo Chg. 97-001
(NW Comer Htg. &
2nd Ave.)
(APPROVED)
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06', ()_,r'/e,
lb.
PUB, HRG.
ORD,2074
(Pk 'ng Permit
Fees)
(IN1RODUCED)
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property at the Northwest Comer of Huntington Drive and Second Avenue, The Four (4)
acre vacant site is zoned C-2 (General Commercial), The property is owned by the
Redevelopment Agency and has been on the market for the past seven (7) years,
Recently, interest has been expressed in developing a hotel on the site, The existing C-2
zoning allows a maximum of three (3) stories, not exceeding 40 feet in height. In order
to provide the most flexibility for development, the Development Services Department
initiated the proposed zone change. The proposed H8 overlay would allow up to eight
stories, 85 feet in height. The Embassy Suites is seven (7) stories, approximately 65'.{)"
in height. Resolution ARA-I72.. which was adopted by Redevelopment Agency in 1993.
requires more intense development of this property than the C-2 zoning, e.g., high rise,
The Planning Commission in its recommendation, noted that adding the "If' overlay
would provide flexibility for future development of the site consistent with the General
Plan and ARA Resolution No, 172.
Mayor HartJicht OPENED the public hearing.
No one came forward to speak in favor or in opposition to this item.
It was MOVED by Councilmember Young, seconded by Mayor Pro tern Kovacic and
CARRIED to CLOSE the public hearing.
Councilmember Kuhn announced that she must abstain from voting on this item due to a
conflict of interest Her husband is partial owner of a building near the subject site in the
redevelopment project area,
It was MOVED by Mayor Pro tern Kovacic, seconded by Counci1member Chang and
CARRIED on roll call vote as follows to APPROVE Zone Change 97-001, adding a high
rise overlay to the C-2 zoned property at the Northwest Comer of Huntington Drive and
Second Avenue; and, DIRECT staff to prepare the appropriate ordinance for adoption at
a later meeting.
AYES: CouncilmembelS Chang, Kovacic, Young and HartJicht
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
ABSTAIN: CounciImemberKuhn
Considerntion of Ordinance No, 2074, amending Sections 3214.4 and 3214.5 of Article
Ill, Chapter 2, Part I, Division 4 of the Arcadia Municipal Code relating to parking
Permit Fees (Uniform Trnffic Ordinance).
A City Ordinance relating to overnight parking was first adopted in 1963, The original
purpose was to minimize thefts of accessories as well as acts of vandalism committed
against vehicles stored overnight on City streets and to enable the street sweeper to
effectively clean the streets without being impeded by parked vehicles. Over time, an
additional valuable benefit and purpose of restricting overnight parking on City streets
was for over-all crime prevention.
The annual fee for an overnight permit is currently $60.00, This fee has been in place
since July 1988, Staff recommends that the fee be in=sed to $84.00 annually and
partial years (i.e., monthly proration for periods less than a year) be increased from $5.00
per month to $7,00 per month.
The City currently issues between 1,400 and 1,500 overnight parking permits and
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generates revenue of approximately $65,000 annually. If the pennit is increased to
$84,00 a year staff estimates that revenues of $90,000 will be generated annually,
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Mayor Harbicht OPENED the public hearing
Lam Metz. 343 East Laurel Avenue, stated in part that prior to 1988 the parking pennit
fee was $10, It then went from $10 to $60. He does not see any reason for the increase
from $60 to $84 a year because there is no service provided for the fee... it is just profit
for the City.
It was MOVED by Councilmember Kuhn, seconded by Councilmember Young and
CARRlED to CLOSE the public hearing.
It was MOVED by Councilmember Young, seconded by Councilmember Kuhn that
ORDINANCE NO. 2074 entitled: "AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY COUNCIL OF
THE CITY OF ARCADIA, CALIFORNIA, AMENDING SECTIONS 3214.4 AND
3214.5 OF ARTICLE III, CHAPTER 2, PART I, DMSION 4 OF THE ARCADIA
MUNICIPAL CODE RELATING TO PARKING PERMIT FEES (UNIFORM TRAFFIC
ORDINANCE)", be and it is hereby INTRODUCED.
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
None
None
AUDIENCE PARTICIPATION
Barbara Graham. 130 East Foothill Blvd., stated in part that her partner, Penny Speer
addressed the City Council at the July I meeting, Ms. Speer presented a petition to the
Council with signatures of 40 merchants in the City requesting that they be allowed to
put merchandise that they sell in front of their shops to attract customers, Mayor
Harbicht advised Ms, Graham of the 6 p,Jn. meeting this date to discuss the downtown
area and some of these other matters such as she mentioned. This particular issue was
not discussed because of time limitations. However, the City Council, Planning
Commission and other interested people will be touring the downtown area to look at
business problems that may apply Citywide, Ms. Graham's shop is located on Foothill
Blvd. She noted that something needs to be done for these merchants also. City ,Code
Enforcement has sent letters to her threatening that she will be fined for placing a couple
of articles from the shop on the sidewalk. The Mayor reminded Ms, Graham that this
issue will be part of Council's discussion following the walking tour of the downtown
area.
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Gail Marshall. 2300 block of Lee Avenue, commended the Council for the summer
concerts at the AIboretum, In response to Ms. Marshall, the City Manager advised that
the City does not receive any direct financial benefit from the AIboretum concerts.
Referring to the City summer concerts and payment for the musicians and cleanup, the
City Manger advised Ms. Marshall that the City pays for those costs. The Mayor noted
the concerts are part of the City's recreation program. He will be at the next City concert
video taping the program "Speaking of Arcadia" and interviewing people in the
audience,
Garland Roberson. representing the Arcadia Business Association, stated in part that the
ABA is also a sponsor of the City concerts. The band "Orange Colored Sky" will
perform on Thursday, July 17th at First Avenue Middle School.
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YOUNG
(Landscape
Mainl)
(pk'ng signs-
Alta Street)
KUHN
(Concerts)
(Arcadia Library
Fdn,)
0102.0 -J,')
A!.S'"
CHANG
(Tobacco sales)
KOVACIC
(Concerts)
(Fire Opt.)
10.
lOa
MINUTES
(June 17 and
July I, 1997)
lOb.
lOe,
IOd.
CONTRACT
AWARD
(Wtr, Meters-
Schlumberger
Ind,)
v:; 1" , I/)
3~:or65
MA TIERS FROM ELECI'ED OFFICIALS
Councilmember Young reported a newly purchased home on Vaquero Road with an
absent owner on which the landscaping is drying up, No one can locate the new ,owners
and the property transfer bas not yet been recorded. She would like the Board of Realtors
to ensure that newly sold properties are maintained.
Counci1member Young reported that "No Parking" signs on Alta Street need to be
coordinated. One side of the street says, "No Parking 8-9" and the other side says "No
Parking 8-10" on different days. The seniors in that area request that the signs be
changed to one hour on each side of the street... 8-9, The Mayor said Mr, Malloy, the
Maintenance Services Director, will look into the matter and respond back to the
Council.
Councilmemher Kuhn also commended the City summer concerts.
Councilmember Kuhn commented that the Arcadia Libraiy Foundation reported that all
of the items in the Foundation brocbure for furnishings for the public rooms at the
Library have been funded. In addition, the Foundation bas purchased more than $47,000
worth of furnishings not listed in the brochure. Total expenses for the campaign
amounted to $12,080,70, The Foundation bas a new "wisb list" of needed items
amounting to more than $150,000. Ms. Kuhn congratulated the Library Foundation and
especially Jesse Vanlandingham for a job well done. Mayor Harbicht also expressed his
appreciation for the super job by the Foundation.
Councilmember Chang displayed brochures of a program to prevent tobacco sales to
minors. The program is sponsored by the "Coalition of Responsible Tobacco Retai1ing".
He is in full support of this program.
Mayor Pro tern Kovacic announced the City summer concerts which are free to all, He
commended the Recreation Commission for introducing the concerts.
Mayor Pro tern Kovacic commended Fire Chief Lavoie and the Fire Deparunent for
keeping the City safe during the Fourth of July holiday. His neighborhood had a garnge
fire and the department was qnickly on the scene. A garnge was severely damaged, but
the deparunent was able to save the car,
CONSENT ITEMS
APPROVED the minutes of the June 17 and July I, 1997 ReguiarMeetings as amended,
See Page No, 8
See Page No. 8
AWARDED a contract in the amount ofSlOO,OOO to Schlumberger Industries, Inc" for
the purchase of water meters under the first option year (the first of three (3) option years
of the original contract), for the water meter replacement program.
AUTHORIZED the City Manager to execute the contract in a form approved by the City
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CONTRACT
AWARD
(Joint AUSD/City
bid - Reroof Fire
Opt 911 Fac.,
City HallIPD
Canopy and
Svcs. Ctr, Reseal)
(Best Roofing)
0730-0/0
lOb,
PROF, SVCS.
AGREEMENT
(12" Wtr, Line
Htg.Dr.)
o tt/.,- - 90
lOco
VACANT POLICE
OffiCER POSI-
TIONS (2)
(Recruit now,
Hire after 8-5-97)
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3~:0l66
Attorney,
AWARDED a contract in the amount of $42,400 to Best Roofing company for the City's
portion of a joint bid with the Arcadia Unified School District, for reroofing t1ie Fire
Department 911 Facility, the City HalVPolice Department canopy and the Phase Two
Service Center reseal; WAIVED all informalities in the bid and bidding process;
AUTHORIZED The City Manager and City Clerk to execute a contract in a fonn
approved by the City Attorney.
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THE ABOVE CONSENT ITEMS lOa., d and e, WERE APPROVED ON MOTION BY
COUNCILMEMBER YOUNG, SECOND BY COUNCILMEMBER CHANG AND
CARRIED ON ROLL CALL VOTE AS FOLLOWS:
AYES: Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
NOES: None
ABSENT: None
ABSTAIN: Councilmember Kuhn (Item lOa. ...did not receive the minutes)
Consideration of the report and recommendation to award a Professional Services
Agreement to IW A Engineers in the amount of $34,065. To provide engineering services
for the design of a 12" waterline on Huntington Drive from Holly Avenue to Baldwin
Avenue.
In response to Mayor Harbicht's question, the City Manager stated that City engineering
staff had considered designing the 12" waterline in-house. This project was sent out for
the design because of the staff workload The Maintenance Services Director also
explained that IW A's bid was negotiated down to what staff believes is a reasonable fee
for the engineering service. Professional Service Agreements are based upon several
criteria in addition to fees, The $34,065 fee is approximately .0975% of the estimated
construction cost of the project.
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It was MOVED by Mayor Pro tern Kovacic, seconded by Counci1member Kuhn' and
CARRIED on roll call vote as follows to A WARD a Professional Services Agreement in
the amount of $34,065,00 to IW A Engineers for the design of the 12" waterline in
Huntington Drive from Holly Avenue to Baldwin Avenue; AUTHORIZE the City
Manager and City Clerk to execute the contract in a fonn approved by the City Attorney.
Consideration of the report and recommendation to authorize staff to fill two police
officer positions which became vacant as a resuli of one retirement and one resignation.
Following a brief discussion the City Council determined that these positions not be filled
until after the mail-ballot vote for the Fire Suppression Assessment District on August 5,
1997,
It was MOVED by Mayor Harbichl, seconded by Counci1member Young and CARRIED
on roll call vote as follows to AUTHORIZE the Police Department to move ahead with
the recruitment process for two Police Officers, but refrain from hiring the officers until
the City Council gives specific authorization to take that final step.
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
None
None
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11.
lla
APPOINTMENT -
YOUTH MASTER
PLAN STANDING
COMTE.
(Kuhn)
O/.;{(J - 9'::,
llb(2)
PUBLlC MfG.
FlRE SUPRSN.
ASSESSMENT
DISTRICT
10 'St) _ Id.
39:0l6~ '
CITY MANAGER
It was MOVED by Mayor Pro tern Kovacic, seconded by Councilmember Young and
CARRIED on roll call vole as follows 10 APPOINT Councilmember Kuhn to serve on the
Youth Master Plan Standing Committee.
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Harbicht
None
None
A TRANSCRIPT HAS BEEN PREPARED FOR TIIE FOLLOWING PUBLlC
MEETING
Consideration of public testimony regarding the formation of a Citywide Fire
Suppression Assessment District (FSAD).
The City Council, during intensive deliberation of alternative plans to resolve the $ 1.5
million deficit in the 1997-98 fiscal year budget, detennined that a new revenue source
must be found to replace declining property, utility and sales tax revenues, Proposition
218, approved by the voters in November, 1996, instituted a property owner maiI-ba11ot
vote process for assessment districts. The process for the proposed Fire Suppression
Assessment District within the City began, and the City retained the services of Willdan
Associates to prepare the Fire Suppression Assessment Engineer's Report, ballots,
informational malerials, public meeting and public hearing notices, mailing of ballots,
and other services to comply with the requirements of Proposition 218, Willdan mailed
the mail-in-ballots containing the levy of an assessment to City property owners on June
20, 1997, The ballots are 10 be returned to the City within a forty-five (45) day window,
stored in the City Clerk's vault, opened and tallied On August 5, 1997, A required public
hearing to receive additional public comment on the proposed Fire Suppression
Assessment District is scheduled for August 5, 1997.
Warren Diven, Brown, Diven and Hentschke, special legal counsel to the City in the
proceedings to consider formation of the District was in attendance to present the process
for implementation of Proposition 218, and Senate Bill 919, which clarified the
procedures.
Following Mr, Diven's presentation, Mayor Harbicht OPENED the public meeting.
The foUowing persons spoke IN OPPOSmON io the proposed levy of an assessment for
Fire Suppression Services:
Robert Ellison, 620 West Huntington Drive
Louis Rubenstein, Fifth Avenue
Gail Marshall, 2300 block of Lee Avenue
Sandra Harp, Loganrita Avenue
Keith Farrell, 500 block of Valido Road
Anne Sobbota, Woodruff Way
Paul Massier, 1000 South First Avenue
Clete Defiori, El Monte Avenue
Harold Ellis, 1504 South Eighth Avenue
Bob Ganther
Lany Metz, 343 East Laurel Avenue
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7/15/97
llb(2)
CITY BALLOTS
FIRE SUPRSN.
DISTRICT
(Abstain from
voting)
/t)3eJ ~ /
12.
ROLL CALL
12a
AGENCY BALLOTS
FIRE SUPRSN.
DISTRICT
(Abstain from
voting)
/(}30-1.:2
ADJOURNMENT
CWSED SESSION
01/1) - f/;J
39:0168
Richard Harris, 143 West Santa Anita Terrace
John D, Cameron, Arcadia property owner residing in Monrovia
Dick Scott, Santa Anita Terrace
The following persons spoke IN FAVOR of the fonnation of a Fire Suppression
Assessment District:
Bob Novell, 1276 Oakglen Avenue
Vincent Foley, Cambridge Drive
At the conclusion of the public meeting, it was MOVED by Councilmember Kuhn,
seconded by Mayor Pro tem Kovacic and CARRIED to CLOSE the public meeting, No
other City Council action was required.
Consideration of the report and recommendation to authorize the City Manager to cast
the City of Arcadia's ballots for the Fire Suppression District. Following a brief
discussion by consensus of the City Council the following motion was adopted:
It was MOVED by Councilmember Young, seconded by Councilmember Kuhn and
CARRIED on roll call vote as follows to REMOVE THE CITY FROM VOTING the City
ballots for the proposed Fire Suppression District.
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Councilmembers Chang, Kovacic. Kuhn, Young and Hartlicht
None
None
THE CITY COUNCIL RECESSED IN ORDER TO ACT AS THE
ARCADIA REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
PRESENT: Agency Members Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Hartlicht
ABSENT: None
Consideration of the report and recommendation to authorize the Agency Executive
Director to cast the Arcadia Redevelopment Agency's ballots for the proposed Fire
Suppression District.
It was MOVED by Agency Member Young, seconded by Agency Member Chang and
CARRIED on roll call vote as follows that the Agency WILL NOT VOTE the Agency
ballots for the proposed Fire Suppression District.
AYES:
NOES:
ABSENT:
Agency Members Chang, Kovacic, Kuhn, Young and Hartlicht
None
None
The Redevelopment Agency ADJOURNED to August 5, 1997.
THE CITY COUNCIL RECONVENED
The City Attorney made the following announcement: "Earlier this evening the City
Council had scheduled two Closed Sessions, one of which was started but not completed
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ADJOURNMENT
39:0169
and will be completed now. And, the other one was not commenced and will be
commenced after this meeting. Those Closed Sessions are, pursuant to Government
Code Section 54956,9(a) to confer regarding the existing workers' compensation case of
Nancy Saxton v, City of Arcadia,
And to continue a Closed Session pursuant to Government Code Section 54957,6 to
confer with City labor negotiator Gary Rogers regarding negotiations with all represented
and unrepresented employees."
At 10:05 p,m, the City Council RECESSED to the Closed Sessions, RECONVENED the
Regular Meeting at 10:50 p,m. and ADJOURNED to Tuesday, August 5, 1997 at 6:00
p.m, in the Conference Room of the City Council Chambers for a Regular Meeting to
conduct the business of the City Council and the Arcadia Redevelopment Agency and any
Closed Session necessary to discuss personnel, litigation matters or evaluation of
properties.
-/c~
Robert C, Harbicht, Mayor of the City of Arcadia
A TrEST:
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TRANSCRIPT
(Insofar as decipherable)
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RELATING TO THE
REGULAR CITY COUNCIL MEETING
AGENDA ITEM lib.
PROPOSED FIRE SUPPRESSION DISTRICT
JULY IS, 1997
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CITYCOUNCILMEETING-JULY 15,1997
ITEM NO. llb.
MAYOR HARBICHT:
CITY MANAGER
KELLY
WARREN DIVEN
(Brown, Diven
& Hentschke)
PUBLIC MEETING TO ACCEPT PUBLIC TESTIMONY ON TIlE FIRE
SUPPRESSION DISTRICT.
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Item B. Mr. Kelly?
Mayor, City Council, This is a two-part presentation,
The first part is a public meeting on public testimony on the Suppression District, and
the second part deals with the issue dealing with the City casting its ballots for the
District. In accordance with State law, a public meeting must take place. This is in
addition to the public hearing. It's a little bit confusing, 1bat's the way the law is
written. The meeting tonight is for the Council to accept public testimony on the
formation of the District. No action is required of the City Council except to listen to
public comments. August 5th is when the Council will hold a formal public hearing to
again accept evidence, or people's positions for or against. So tonight is just
presentation to the Council with no Council action reqnired.
As the Council is aware, on June 20th of this year, we began mailing out ballots to
property owners of record, relative to the formation of the District as outlined in the
material. It relates to the issue of the City's budget deficit, or imbalance, and how this is
not a temporary situation, it's been ongoing for some time and will not get better unless
there's either a permanent increase in revenue or a permanent increase in spending.
And the Council put this forward to the citizens to make the determination as to which
they would prefer to do.
The formation of the District is outlined in State law, We had an engineer's report
prepared which identifies the hasis of the District, the cost to be allocated on the
individual properties based upon the formulas defined, and sets forth the process for
considering the adoption of this program. As you are aware, the budget deficit is based
upon continuation of the loss of State funds, property tax revenues declining. We're still
in a recession. We've lost utility tax and sales tax hasn't gone back up to where it used
to be. The Council is faced with between a $1.5 and $2 million deficit in teons of
services, and that's de5J!ite everything you've done to cut costs.
Proposition 218, as approved by the voters in November of last year, instituted another
level of processing which authorizes, requires cities to mail out these halIots to be then
submitted back to the city in a 45-day window. The State of California, the Legislature,
hasjust recently adopted amendments to implementation of218.
Mr. Warren Diven, our Special Counsel on theDistrict, is here this evening to give the
Council an overview of just the recent changes on 218 and what SB 919 does to the
process. Following Mr. Diven's comments, we're suggesting the Council open up the
meeting to public comment The city staff; myself, the city attorney, the consultants are
here should any questions arise from the Council on the process. At this point, I'll ask
Mr. Warren Diven to give the Council and the public a brief overview on just what
changed recently on the impact of 218 and the process.
Good evening, Mr. Mayor, members of the City Council.
My name is Warren Diven, with the law firm of Brown, Diven and Hentschke,
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We're acting as Special Counsel to the city in the proceedings to consider formation of
this Fire Suppression Assessment District.
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COUNCILMEMBER
CHANG
DIVEN:
CHANG
As the City Manager indicated, on July 1st of this year, the Governor signed Senate Bill
919, the first piece of legislation to help to implement Proposition 218 and to provide
public agencies and the general public with some tools to implement and to facilitate the
use of Proposition 218. This bill was known as a consensus measure, that is, it was
supported by both public agencies, including the League of California Cities, and the
Howard Jarvis Troqmyers' Association, as the proponents of Proposition 218. All of the
provisions included in Senate Bill 919 have the concurrence and the support of both of
these divergent groups of people.
What Senate Bill 919 does is that, as it applies here in Arcadia and the proposed Fire
Suppression Assessment is that it does ratify the city's proposed use of the mail ballot
procedure that you currently are undergoing. It also ratifies the methodology that the
city has proposed for annual adjustments in the Fire Suppression Assessment
Additionally, the bill provides that if we follow the notice, protest and hearing
requirements set forth in Senate Bill 919, which the city is doing at this point in time,
that supersedes the requirements or any other statutory requirements for notice, protest
and hearing.
Now what that means in this particular case is that when we sent the notices out, and
before Senate Bill 919 was in place, we had two sets of protest requirements that we had
to Cllmply with, the provisions of Proposition 218, the mail ballot provisions, and the
provisions of the Fire Suppression Assessment Law, which allow property owners to
submit to you separate written protests. And if you received separate written protests
from property owners representing 10% or more of the proposed Fire Suppression
Assessments within the city, you'd be required to submit the question of levying the
assessment to the registered voters, which really would be a redundant step in this case,
since we're already going through a ballot procedure. Senate Bill 919 says that, that
separate written protest procedure is now superseded, and the city would not be required
to submit the levy of the assessments to an additional vote requirement
It does not mean, however, that the City Council can't take into consideration any
correspondence that you receive from your constituency, and you certainly can take into
account any separate written protests that you may receive beyond the ballots that are
actua1ly submitted.
Additionally, Senate Bill 919 now provides that a property owner may change their
ballot, or even withdraw their ballot, if they choose to, at any time up to the close of the
public hearing. So if a property owner has cast a ballot either in favor o( or in
opposition to, the levy of the assessment, and they come to the public hearing on August
5th, and 'after listeuing to the testimony, decide that they want to change their ballot,
they will have the ability to do that, so long as that's done prior to the conclusion of the
public hearing.
Finally, Senate Bill 919 provides that the assessment ballot procedure that the city is
following is, in fact, is not an election in the traditional sense of the word, but in fact,
just a ballot procedure that allows property owners to now express their support for, or
their opposition to, the levy of the assessment, by the submission of a ballot, but it is not
an election within the traditional sense of the word. I'd be happy to answer any
questions that the Mayor or the Council may have regarding this legislation.
I do have questions.
You just mentioned that according to Senate Bill 919, that now the voters can change
the ballots after the public hearing.
No, at any time up until the conclusion of the public hearing,
At any time up to the conclusion of the public hearing.
2
DIVEN:
CHANG
DIVEN
CHANG
MAYOR HARBICHf
DIVEN
MAYOR HARBICHf
KELLY
MAYOR HARBICHf
ROBERT ELLISON
Yes,
Now, you know that on August 5, there will be a public hearing, On that night, we also
tabulate ballots. How does it technically allow the voters to change their mind, since we
have this public hearing, and also the tabulation of the vote on the same nighl? How do
we technically?
Well, we'll be working with staff to put that procedure together, But essentially what
would happen is that a property owner would approach the City Clerk or the staff that
are working on the tabulation of the ballot, indicate that they had previously submitted a
ballot, and now wish to either withdraw that ballot, or to change that vote. They'd be
provided with a new ballot and would be permitted to complete that ballot and turn that
in.
I
Thank you.
Let me ask the same question maybe in a different way. What I'm saying is, that night,
if I've already submitted my ballot, and I've voted, for example, in favor of it, and then I
decided that night that I wanted to vote against it, we've got like 5,000 ballots that are
going to come in. Are they going to be alphabetized or something, so they can find it,
pull it out and change it?
They'll be identified, they'll be computer inputted, and be input in the tabulation. And
if the property owner can identifY their assessor's parcel number, then it will be, then
we'll be able to, then they'll be able to change their vote.
Sounds like it ought to be fun. Before we open the public meeting, Mr. Kelly would like
to make clarification of a couple of his comments.
Mayor, Council, in my presentation, I referenced May 5th for some reason, it's on
August 5th, so August 5th is the public hearing. August 5th is the public hearing on the
District, and in my presentation on the budget, the alternative that the City Council has
is to either increase revenue or decrease spending, That's just to clari1Y my previous
presentation. Mr. Mayor.
OK. At this point, we're going to open the public meeting, and we have quite a few
people here this evening, and since very few of you got up to speak on these other items,
l've taken a wild guess that maybe you' re here about this one. So I would like to ask, I
want evetyone to have,the opportunity to speak who wants to speak, and so I would like
to ask that you please try to restrict your comments to five minutes or less.
So we will open the public meeting and I'll invite anyone who cares to address the
Council to please come forward. In each case we would like you to give us your name
for the record. '
Good evening. I'm Robert Ellison, I live at 620 West Huntington Drive in Arcadia, I
speak for myself and with her permission for my wife BarlJara. We are vigorously
opposed to the Fire Suppression District. To the best of our memories, it is the first time
that we have ever voted against a tax, and we've been voting a long time.
It is with reluctance that we do this, because we are sure that all of us want and are
willing to pay taxes in order to have the excellent services we have always had provided
to us by the City of Arcadia The following are the reasons for our opposition.
Somewhat over a year ago, we were assured that the city's finances were sound. How
can we be sure that those responsible for managing our finances are correct now?
Passing this issue will permit the city to continue this tax for 20 years. Do we wish to I
continue to pay a tax that may not be needed?
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Apparently the law states that the city m~ tell us to sign our ballots, Has any of us ever
signed a ballot before? Certainly thC, Council should blive 'made some, or conld have
made'some, certainly, way, that hom.eowm:rs co,uld vote without having to sign their
ballot It may be the law, but it certaiDIy isn't democracy, and it certainly isn't the
American way.
MAYORHARBIOIT Ladies and gentlemen.' This is a business meeting. And I'd like to ask that everyone
please refrairi from demonstrations; We'd like to have everyone have the opponunity to
speak, but let's conduct it in a business1ike way. Mr. Ellison, please continue,
EWSON It.'~ ~~Sai4iiuii.~, tQli#iY i:Oii)4't8keoVe~our Fife ~~ent and save the city
IiiQney: We d0!1o(kn,6w if~ is'~~ Bii~ apjlifrj:ilpy,this avenue has not been
completely reviewed. ShoulilWe notmow about this befilr'e any tax is passed?
WhY ~ city rri~n"geni~t sho~ ;0 !iiiIe ~denCe of.befug aWessive in enlarging our
taXl!3se? lJardly Ii so1jI .is seen ~n Huntington Drive ,'and FirSt Avenue $8 million later.
WhCre'are our au\O agencies? Where'iire ii~WaIqUuts~ Wh* are our Home Depots?
where are our Targets? Where are oui ~li3I!s? .
. ,
Why are all of us going to pay the same amount of tax? We are told that it takes the
same amount of trucks and personnel to respond to a fire whether a small residence or a
large one. We can a9CCPt that ~nse, but it is difficult for,us, to understand how it can
take as much equjpme'!t and'material to quench a fire in ,a: I,OOO-square-foot residence
as in a 5 0~.6,o.<)(j-~-fo!!t residence. What happened'to progressive taxation? We
believe our citY goVemirieni shonld resPond to reasonable doubts before imposing
questionable taxes on its citizens.
LOuis RiJBENSTEIN ,My n.ame is io~.~i1stew. .1, live in ,Mcac!ia. and J iia;e, sO!fie comments regarding
the piocess of the baIlcit It has iIlways becii , I'm not a laWyer, but it has always been
my understanding that under the United States and the,California Constitution,'public
elections should be secret As a Iilatter of fact, I vote very, often by absentee ballot, and I
sign,.!fiY ~ ~nthe, flutsi4e, and, ~~re is a ~t bal.\9! iI!si,de, and thus my vote is not,
identified. . , .. .' , "
When I looked at this ballot".I was really shocked., Here it is, yes, I support the Fire
Department, no, I don't, I do not support the Fire Department, 'here's my address, here's
my house. I used to work on Long Island, New York. There we had volunteer fire
departments. And it was very well known, that if you dido't volunteer for the volunteer
fire department, if you had a fire, your seMCe was not as good as when, as someone who
did volunteer. So I think it's within the technical reaIm of possibility for the Council to
anange a ballot in which a person's vote cOuld be secret.' 'Thank you.
MAYOR HAREIOIT I mlgi.,t, just ,'r:esPPnd to two things. The p~~ f~r tiie ballot is laid out in
propoSition 218. ~ition 2~8 ~ilof 3lippted by, us, It was adopted by the people
of Califoliiia, and we're responding to the liallcii proposition, which is now part of the
State! cinstitutio~ ~hi"h you P,;!t in thefe. '"
And I would like to say, I mean, that this comment was made in jest. But, to suggest
that our fire I?epa,rtment would hilv~ ,~e slightest bit of 4ifference in response or
professi&)IaIisnj,~,on someOn~'s vot~ on ~ ballot is ludicrous, And I completely
reject that,~ rthink it n~, to be Said, tWIt I didri't bring it up, but that's certainly
not;werulve"an'eXu,:rnieIYprofessisinal Fire J:?epartnien!'"..Fl!r those of you who don't
knOw, there are 23 cid~ in the United, ~ta~ of Am~!:ica that have Class I fire ratings,
and ~dia is oite of them. ~ climes from having ail ~bsolutely professional Fire
DepartIitent ..
4
RUBENSTEIN
MAYOR HARBICHT
GAIL MARSHALL
CITY ATTORNEY
MIlLER
MARSHALL
MIlLER
MARSHALL
MAYOR HARBICHT
MARSHALL
I'm sorry, I did not me&) to suggest that this was the intent of anyone to implement such
a procedure. But from the point of view of the voter, that could be read into it. And that
po~bility should not reaIly exist:'
Thank you, Mr. Rubenstein.
Gail Marshall; 2300 block of Lee Avenue. This morning r was getting ready for work
and my telephone rili1g, and it was Gino Roncelli calling me. And he regretted that he
couldn't attend the CoUncil meeting this evening, and was talking to me about some
t!?~. that he had,that,.~p~ed, to ~ ~1'IC ~nceI1)S also that I had been thinking
~\'I;,l1!e last ,<iOuple 6~ weeks"" ~ I agreed ~'represent hiIH and please note in the
miniItes'that these questions and 'opinionS' are from Gino and inyself.
'.~ ~'. (. c." .' . " " '. ....1 ; " .'
We have some questions regB)'ding the legll1ity concerning the Fire Suppression
"'-'<,"- .,' ., '1~.' .1:"" . . :
, Asses)iine~ We are the first city to addiesS the Fire Supi>~sion Tax under Proposition
218, I h~ you are ,1l11 cJear as to the law on this i$Je, as there are some questions that
we're very' iincieil(aboul- I have a problem with the budget that bas money for
entertainment, eVeri though I'ni excitCd to go these concerts. They have a budget for
entertainment, but not for protection. It's like telling your kids, "Sorry, no food to eat
for a month, but on the brighter side, we can go to Disneyland."
Now, I do have' a question. Monrovia itiid a School,Board Tax Assessment. They
nee4iid'67% to pl!!ls, that. They'did: Who se~ 'the Fire Suppression Tax at 51% for
passage? Is it the FC<deral Government that does that? I don't know. Does anybody
know? '
That's in the Proposition 218, and in the Fire Suppression Law, the State of California,
whith ~ U; the GOVeriiment Code, that's sectiori 50i178, Thit's what's reqnired.
._'" _" .. _ n ,_ _.~ . ,_ .
OK. . I was just wondering. there's a lot of different assessment taxes, and there's a big
discrepancy between 5 1% and the 67%.
This is' declned by be, by Ia~, ail'3sseSsiDent as dism;gwsiied from a tax. There is some
difference. In the law there is a difference, let me put it that way. This is an assessment
based on benefits that accrue to the property, as opPosed to a tax, which is basically
imposed whether benefits accrue-or not. A special tax, in the Law of California,
requires a 2/3 vote. An assessment, which this is, requires just a majority.
OK, that answers it, t1\an1c you.
l".... . " .~ -
You are our elected officials who represent us on making decisions. The city property
is, in essence, owned by the citizens. This vote is for the property owners. When the
city casts, seyerll1 yes, votes ~or the city, I ~e you are e~g this to pass, and this
is what t1ii:' residentS want. You do not laiow this. Thai is the reason for the mail-in
ballot, to'~ what~ we re3I.I~ do 'Iknt. Th~ cOUncil has, allowed one vote per household,
as are thC 'rest of us. Ftowever, we see it as they are casting one ballot as a property
owner, and then appointing 'someone to vote for aIi the ciiy' property. That, to us, means
severaI votes per Council member, in essence.
I did nQti~ on the ag~I!,~. ~ the CitY ~g~ is going tp be appointed to cast the
votes f9r the city~ \yith' an 'diW,~ Mi; Kelly, I cion't~ow if you are a property
~er, I.~o~'t beIii:\:e' you live,Ui,~I!ia"andI"kind ofqu~on the casting voted by
somebody wh~ doesn't 1jve here aDd po,~iblyisn't a propert): ~wner. Having the City
Maitager =i'the City voi~ is like letting tJte'fox count the,chickens. Are public-owned
properties, Such as city, stale aild federal, exempt from tli<es.1
The School District, County, State and Federal are exempt.
But not the city.
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MAYOR HARBICHf The city is not exempt I might just add, I don't want to interrupt your comments here,
but what you're referring to is merely the staff recommendation. The Council has not
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acted on that point yet That's the next item on the agenda. That's why, you're
addressing it now.
MARSHAlL I saw it on there. Gino RoncelU and I feel we are dealing with <I conflict of interest, as it
is presently set up. We strongly feel that the city should take a neutral stand, and refrain
for voting for the residents concerning city property. It would be a shame, after all the
money spent, the time committed to this proposal, to see this challenged in court due to
the implementation of this process. Thank you for your time.
SANDRA HARP Good evening. My name is Sandra Harp, We live on Loganrita in Arcadia. As a little
bit of aside, we live in an area of Arcadia served by Monrovia schools because of a
strange school districting, so we are being hit with Monrovia's new assessment for
schools. So in addition, now, we are facing this Fire Suppression Assessment, which for
us will be a double hit
At this point we have a lot of questions. I'm not sure why it's called Fire Suppression
District, and if I've understood correctly, we're being assessed to take care of the Fire
Department The money that's there now for the Fire Department would be moved to
the Genernl Fund and pay for Police Department and other services, Is that correct?
MAYOR HARBICHT Just for clarification. We currently'spend about $7.5 million a year to operate our Fire
Department This Assessment District would raise $2,2 million a year, That money, all
of that money would go into operating the Fire Department It would free up funds from
the Genernl Fund, which is currently funding the entire Fire Department, to operate
police, libraries, some of the other services,
HARP And there wasn't some way to leave the Fire Department funds intact and raise money
to take care of all of the other services?
MAYORHARBICHf I don't know what you mean by leave the Fire Department funds intact The situation
that we were faced with is, we have a significarit deficit in our budget And so it was a
matter of, the question that was before the Council, and which we sat down to study,
was, where are we going to cut? Where are you going to make these permanent, long-
term cuts? And when we started looking at making cuts from the Fire Department,
making cuts from the Police Department, cuts from the Library, the question became, is
this what the citizens would want us to do? And so we decided to give the citizens the
option of either saying, "Make those cuts; or "We would rather pay a little extra to
maintain services at the current level." So that's essentially how we got to where we are
today. The question is before the citizens as to what they want to do.
HARP From my standpoint, we have two sons that are Fire Captains. So we are very pro Fire
Department Probably it would be possible to cut other services, I think the city is
probably as good as its Police Department arid its Fire Department, and I don't like to
see things happening like holding off hiring two much-needed policemen, waiting for a
vote to be taken. I think the Police and Fire Departments should be maintained at their
current level, or the highest poSSIble level, and find cuts other places, Like I said there
are still a lot of questions in my mind. I have not decided one way or the other right
now. I'm hoping to get c1arification tonight
MAYORHARBICHf Mrs. Harp, ifl may talk about that issue for a second. That's really the question, is do
we want to maintain the same level of services that we have? If this fails, we have to
cut There's not question about it And that's the reason we authorized, and to continue
the process toward hiring those two policemen, and at our last meeting, toward hiring,
toward filling a library slot that has come open, but we may be going right back into
budget sessions on August 6. That's the reason we said, "Go ahead, continue the
process, but don't make the final decision until after that" That's all that is.
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Now where would you make these cuts in the Fire Department? Would you close
stations? Would you cut personnel? Would you end up paying overtime? How would
that work?
MAYOR HARBIClIT Well, that has yet to be detennined exactly how we would do it. An option is to close
one of our three flre stations.
HARP:
HARP
MAYOR HARBIClIT
HARP
MAYOR HARBICIIT
HARP
MAYOR HARBIClIT
HARP
MAYOR HARBICHT
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, Our city is served by only three fire stations.
Yes. ActuaJJy, that's qu)te a few: We're a Class I fire rating, As I said, there are only
n_' .
I bl?w theY're good, but I thought there ~,more thai1 three.
No. We're very well covered by fire. We have a very high level of service, and I'm not
making any bones about that. It's a question of do we want to maintain this high level
of service that we've had for many, many years.
An you're saying you cannot maintain the Fire Department without these funds, and you
cannot make cuts anywhere else within the city budget.
Just by way of expllination On that. Approxinuitely 213 of our budget are safety services.
Police, fife, paramedics. We're taIIdng about h3ving to cut about, close to 10% of our
budget. You cannot do it, and ignore the two biggest components in your budget. Even
if we close the library 'totally, lock the doors for the year, it wouldn't make up the deficit.
So we're looking at some across the board cuts. But across the board would have to
include police and fire.
Believe me, I don't want to make the cuts. I persoIially plan to vote for the District. But
if the citizens tell us to make the cuts, then that's what we're going to be faced with
doing,
I sense a certain amount of anger from some of the people who have spoken at this
meeting and some of the other meetings at the Council, Basically, we're saying, you tell
us what you want to do. I mean; I'll be very up frout about it. I persoIially am going to
vote yes for this. I know the kinds of servi~ that I want in this community. I blow the
kind of community I want to live in. And, I happen to own four pieces of property in
this community, so I'm going to pay more than a lot of people. And my renters are
going to enjoy the same. services, because I'm paying this extra amount.
. ., . \
But ifotheri,don'tf~l that they waIlt to d!l that, and the majority say they don't want to
do that, then we will make the cUts. I will, I can't speak: for the others, I will insist that
we make the'CIits in our budget and bring this budget into balance. I'm not going to
continue,to spend the city's reserves. And so, it's really a pretty simple question.
. -',' ~, , ' . ,
YeS, it W!l1!!~ be: nice if we c9.uld say, "Well, l~~s don't tone!! police, let's don't touch
firi:." Of course, we have peopj~ who ta1<e adVaiiiage of the librilry and passionately love
Jhat h'brary' ,,:ho would be rather upset at all the cuts ~, lIJId we have people who take
part in the' recreation progr.iin. We have' hundreds of children in our recreation
program. If we cut that out. or sigru.flcantly cut that, we're going to be very unhappy
aliout that. So, it's' not lUCI CaSy decision. .' , .
We're just going to have to, if the citizens tell us that's what we should do, then we're
'just go,ing to!\3Ve ig'hse'our viry ~j~i:lgt11ent ,h~to do i~ i~ such a way that would
have the least'impact on the cOrilmwijiy. But believe me, the nnpact will be there.
Now, I've heard a lot of comment about the downtown area and the money that was
spent on that. Is that curtailed now, you're not going to spend any more money on that?
If I could jUst oommeOt on that, because there have, been a number of questions about
that. And, I'll prefuce my comments by s:iying I was not in favor of doing that. I voted
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HARP:
MAYOR HARBICHT
HARP
KEITII FARRELL
against it And so I can be an independent voice. So I have to assure you that what was
done in the downtown area has nothing to do with the General Fund budget. Those are
water funds, those were street funds, those were redevelopment funds. I'm not ,saying
they should have been spent or shouldn't have been spent What I'm saying is, they
have no impact on the General Fund budget.
Ofcouroe that money is all spent now, and it's a done thing. I was just kind of thinking
that maybe, you're not going to do it any more.
OK, we're prevented by law from. I want to point out, too, that those other funds that I
talked about, street funds come from gas tax moneys. By law, they have to be spent on
streets, The water funds are moneys that we keep separate from the General Fund and
spend only on water projects and operating our water system. And redevelopment funds
can only be spent on redevelopment projects in the Redevelopment Agency. None of
those funds could be transferred in any way to the General Fund. So we don't have the
option of saying. "Well, gee, ifwe hadn't done that, we could..." We'd just have more
money in those funds. We couldn't transfer them into the General Fund.
The General Fund is where our problem is. We have a General Fund budget of about
$25 million a year. That's the amount of money we take in each year, and the amount
of money we spend to rUn the city. And we're short about $2 million on the take-in
side.
I don't want to dominate the hearing here, but, what happened is that a year ago, we
adopted a balanced budget We made some significant cuts. We cut 11-1/2 positions.
On this current budget, we cut five more positions. We went to every other week with
street sweeping. We did a number of things which were fairly significant cuts, and we
adopted a balanced budget
Unfortunately, as the year wore on, and about 4-5 months ago, we took a look at the
mid-year "Where We Stood, " and on this $25 million in spending plan, we were within
$10,000 of what we had budgeted to spend. But we were almost $2 million below in
revenue, the result of deregulation has caused utility rates to decline precipitously, which
means that our income from utility tax has declined at the same rate. We anticipated a
decline in utility tax. They declined even faster than we anticipated. Sales tax has not
picked up. The State continues to take $2 million a year in property tax away from the
City of Arcadia that we used to get, a problem shared by all cities.
So all of these things have come together to basically have a revenue shortfall So even
though we cut costs significantly a year ago and thought we had a balanced budget, the
revenue has fallen behind. And that's essentially how we got to where we are.
I think you've answered my questions. Thank you.
Good evening. My name is Keith Farrell and I live in the 500 block of Valido. I
hesitate, like, from hearing other people, to give my exact address. I would like to
acknowledge my thanks for being able to participate in this process tonight, and express
my opinion.
I want to first express my resentment at a taxation process that is clearly designed to
thwart the will of the people as expressed by the original Howard Jarvis Proposition 13
Tax Reform Amendment, as passed by California voters. I recognize that this may be a
legal process to tax people, but it is not, like so many things that are legal, it's not right
I reserve the right to contest this issue at a later date should it somehow be instituted by
the Council.
This so-called Fire Assessment District is nothing more than a tax on the entire city to
increase the General Fund in order that the city not have to make necessaty adjustments
to balance its budget I have read the Wilden study on the Assessment District, and
8
there appears to be no actual fire suppression benefit to many of the payers of the tax. I
have spoken with my fire insurance carrier, who also happens to be an Arcadia resident,
and he has indicated to me that even if fire services are cut and our city fire rating drops
from a'l as it is now, to a 3, that there would be no increase in my insurance premium.
Arcadia, I understand, is the ouly city of its size in the nation to have been given this
rating of Number I. I'm vel)' proud of that, but I'm not sure we can afford it
Second, I would like to comment on poSSIble misapplication of the Assessment District
I also object to the appropriateness and fairness of the proposed Assessment District
The city has as much said that the pUrpose of this increased revenue is to maintain the
current level of city services. I think that was just reiterated earlier. It should not be the
purpose of the Assessment District to offset poor budgetary planning by the city.
Admittedly, you have had some surprises, But rather, it should be a realistic
apportionment of cost to benefit realized, That is the purpose of the Assessment
District.
I object to the way that the benefits and the resultant tax was applied. No allowance was
made for the increased benefit that certain locations, or types of construction, would
enjoy. For example, houses that are in a higher fire-prone area, such as in the hillsides,
would pay the same as I would where I live down in the flatlands, where possibly they
would be getting more fire benefit than me, and yet paying the same, Also, those houses
that would be closer to, or further away from, a potential third fire station that would be
closed, would be getting certain benefits and they should also pay a difference in the fee,
That's at least the way the Assessment District is supposed to work, according to my
reading of the rules. And I don't think these things are taken into consideration. No
allowance for construction materials was taken into account in the study.
The homes most affected by later response times, by the closing of one fire station, for
example, would be buildings of more flammable materials or in the case of residences,
houses with wooden shingles, These types of structures would reap an increased benefit
from a shorter response' time and should pay proportionately higher fees. No such
allocations are made in the proposed Assessment District, which is therefore unfair and
may, accordingly, be illegal and unenforceable.
I don't want to go over certain things that have already been said about budgets, I think
everyone kind of understands this is a real problem. We have to address it properly, I
would venture to say that I would support, and most people in this room would support
this tax, given the shortfall in the income that we have in the budget, certaiuly for a
short period of time, three years. Not 20 yearsl
I'm a businessman. I own a business in Arcadia I operate another business in Arcadia
And I can tell you in the business that I operate, I'm performance based. If I don't
perform in three months, consecutive months; I lose my job. I would be more than
willing to give you three years as a city to figure ont a way to solve this problem. I
understand you are constrained by labor contracts and things like that. But I think
certainly a three-year bailout, I would be willing to support.
One alternative I wanted to mention in terms of saving money, and this is where I didn't
want to give my street address, has to do with the cost of fire suppression. I asked some
questions of, I don't want to put him on the spot, but what was his name, Casalou?
Yes, Mike Casalou, and he informed me of some (cassette end,., picking up with next
cassette). with benefits, divided by 61 firemen, which is what I'm told there were, that's
an average salary of $103,000 per year. Now that seems obviously excessively high.
I'm hoping to goodness that I'm wrong. But it seems to me, in knowing many people
working in fire departments, it's not probably too far out ofline,
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These firemen do a wonderful job. I've been served by them. And after I've been served
by them, 1 can tell you that I've also been sent a bill by them, which didn't exactly
please me either. But 1 did receive vel)' good service.
These firemen work 10 days a month. Ten days a month, OK? Yes, 1 undemand that
it's 56 hours a week. They do get to sleep 16 of those h,ours, presumably. I've
witnessed these firemen do fire inspections at my businesses. It; s not a high pressure job
except when they're fighting fires.
Now I've asked about how many fires there are per year. And 1 don't know if these are
absolute answers, 1 just got them over the phone, 1 couldn't verify it, one of the captains
did not return my call and get the message back to me. But according to, once again
I'm sorry for putting Mr. Casalou on the spot, but that's where 1 got the information, he
estimated there are about 135 fires a year, Of those 135 fires, approximately, and this is
the number 1 don't know, approximately 30 are structure fires, the ones we really are
worried about The others he estimated were probably mostly car fires. Now, this is
what 'I was told, 1 can't verify this. Now let me please explain how this works. The
worst fires would be the structure fires. If there are 30 fires a year, and there are three
fire departments, or stations, 1 should say, that means each fire station responds to 10
fires. Now, there's three crews at each fire station, because they ouly work 10 days a
month. Now, that means each fireman responds to three fires to four fires a year! Now,
can 1 have this job? How can I apply for this job?
I will admit that my numbers are skewed probably in a certain direction, because there's
other personnel or other part-time people that skew the average. But eveI)' fireman I've
ever known had a second job because they only work 10 days a month. My solution to
your dilemma in the budget is one that my corporation, that I work for, instituted on
about 30 to 60 percent of the employees of the firm that I do work for, And that was to
remove all our benefits in the situation of corporate downsizing. The benefits paid to
the Fire Department are $ L5 million a year. Now, if I'm making $78,000 a year, which
is approximately how much 1 make now, 1 actually pay for my own benefits, my own
40 I (k) plan. Why can't the Fire Department personnel do that? Let's take that $1.5
million away in benefits. I still think the resultant hours are more than adequate, Just
for three years. Just for three years. I'm not talking about forever, Let's staIl those
benefits. Let's catch up.
My salary went down over the last six years, I can assure you, about 10 to 20%.' My
home pricing went down. The only thing that hasn't gone down is salaries. They've
stayed the same, I undemand. There was a hiring freeze, but 1 haven't heard anything
about salary cuts anywhere.
Two other solutions, $20/year for a library card will raise about $1 million if everybody
buys one. That's a voluntary tax. I would certainly be willing to support it
Methodist Hospital. Is there some way we can revoke their tax-exempt status? That
would certainly generate a lot of revenue. I know when 1 go there 1 spend a lot of
money. 1 don't see doctors driving too many lousy cars. And I would also like to say
that the hospital does not provide any special care or education that would be construed
as anything other than, say, marketing services. They already charge so much that my
medical insurer makes me travel to Huntington Hospital anyway. So, anyway,
appreciate the comments, or time to comment Thank YOIL
MAYOR HARBIClIT Thank you, Mr. Farrell. Just to comment on a couple of things there. Please, ladies and
gentlemen, as 1 said, this is a business meeting. Just to comment on a couple of things
that the number of people that are covered by that saiaIy figure includes dispatchers and
other civilian personnel. So we are talking about something over 80 people, The other
thing is, in tenns of the number of fires, 1 don't have the figures in front of me, if we
10
ANNE SOBBOTA
could just get everybody to schedule their fires from 9 to 5, we could save a ton of
money. But the problem is we don't know when they're coming, so we have to have full
crews ready to put them out whenever they do come.
Hi. my name is Anne Sobbota and I live on Woodruff Way in Arcadia. I have to clarifY
a few things here. I didn't come here tonight as the wife of a ~ghter. But I am. An
Arcadia firefighter. And I am a high school teacher for the' public school system of
California, and I can tell you that my saIaIy is higher than my husband's. And that is a
sad statement.
I came here because I've been working all week. I took your suggestions, Mayor
Harbicht. I went, I researched, I talked to the people in the city. I talked to the people
in the county. I listened to all the videotapes. I read the fire report. I wanted answers,
because I was upset that the city didn't provide us with any answers in here.
I came here with a prepared speech. This last gentleman just made me so incensed
because people don't understand what the Fire Department is about. The Fire
Department is there because you pay them to be there in case you have a problem, and
that's what you're paying for.
And those benefits. I read that February 11th Green Book that you referred to. And I
called Mr. Casalou and I said, "Your numbers don't add up. How can you get rid of one
fire suppression person and save $118,000 and get rid of nine paramedics and only save
$650,0007" There are a lot of reasons that are not listed in those booklets for those
wage savings. There are a lot of reasons why your numbers don't add up, and people
don't understand that unless they get research.
I took the time. I spent about 50 hours in the last week and a half to research this,
because the city does not supply the citizens with accurate, or detailed, or well-informed
information regarding this wbole Fire Suppression District. I made an agreement with
my husband that I would stand up here and make sure that you understood that I'm
standing up here as a citizen concerned about this, As a teacher, my job is to teach kids
how to think logically, teach people how to solve problems creatively, and teach people
to seethe bigger picture than what's going on.
And this City Council has failed, And I admire each and every one of you sitting up
there, because, you're willing to be our leaders and you're willing to take on
responsibility to speak -for us and to put yourselves on the line and not be subject to
popular opinion, and I admire that. And Dr, Chang, I especiaIly admire you, because at
every Council meeting that I've viewed on tape, you are the one member that tries to get
the details accurate. It's a testament to your character and your conscientiousness and I
appreciate that.
Mayor Harbicht, you challenged us to look and get information, and I'm challenging
you to provide these citizens with information. People are angry because you didn't do
that. You made a statement that says, Arcadians have told us they do not want to
continue the same level of seivice, and the City Council wiII have to make major cuts.
You asking US to vote on something that you didn't even say anywhere in your literature
you still won't cut.
The Fire Department has an $8 million a year budget. The Police Department has
nearly the same budget. You're using them as bargaining chips. We want our Police
Department. We want our Fire Department. It's our constitutional right, and your
responsibility under the California State Constitution to provide those things to us. It's
not your right to use them. It's not your right to hold them up for purposes to
manipulate us into voting for taxes or to hold them up as possible cuts when it comes
time to give them wage increases. Those people wolk hard. They're going 24 hours a
day. Sometimes they're gone 5 or 6 days a week. And if you don't think that makes it
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BOB NOVELL
hard on the people at home, you're wrong. I didn't come here for that purpose, but I just
have to say, people just don't understand,
I called Los Angeles County Fire Depai1ment and spoke to one of their chiefs in the
supervising. or the public survey department, to find out what it means to get a fire
department survey. It's S65.$7500 and you spent $100,000 pn this Fire Suppression
District alone. '
You didn't take any other options. You didn't give us any other options. You gave us
two choices. Vote for the Suppression District, give us S2 million, or we're going to cut
your Fire Department. Which do you want? We don't want either. We want some
more solutions. I listened to your videotapes, and I really, really wanted to see that the
City Council was not being manipulative. And I just, I can't, if you're not being
manipulative, you're being short-sighted.
I find it hard to justify spending Sloo,OOO when you could have spent 50 for a fire
suppression report, SIO,Ooo for the legal consultation on it, S6500 for a County survey,
maybe another $50,000 for a survey on utility tax, another S50,000 on whatever other
surveys, marketing surveys, all kinds of research you could have done and come to us in
a couple of months and told us, "Here are all your options."
We don't want to cut services either. We don't want to take away the things you value
either. But you didn't give us any other options, You even said tonight, "I will make
cuts." Well, I understand you're a conservative, You said that in your videotape. You
said that you have a certain way of balancing the budget. Mr, Kelly does too, I read the
budgets for the last, since 1991. I never read a budget before. But I wanted to know
what it meant. I wanted to see where the money went. And why it wasn't there, And
you're right. You haven't been guilty of runaway spending. But the city hasn't been
guilty of response, responsible spending either. You spent S3 million on Fire Station 2,
a few more million dollars on fire trucks so that you could be a Class 1 city. And I have
to tell you, your firefighters were Class 1 before you spent all that money! But it's the
people (applause from audience),
Just one more thing I want to say. I'm up here because the whole structure of this issue
is taking away from the people. You bnild a libraI}' so people will come and get
knowledge, You build a fire station so people will be there to help other people. You
build a Community Center, you build a downtown area, also for people to be there. And
the one thing that you want to cut, is people. And you even said, your budget is 80%
abwt the people. And yet, you aren't willing to take that into consideration.
And I really hope you will, because 1 would hate to see the city end up in the situation of
Azusa or Alhambra or one of those cities where the public is angry with their Council,
or the Fire Department is angry with their Council. It's'not too late for you to make
other choices and give us other choices, and I reaIly hope you will. Thank you.
My name is Bob Novell. I'm a citizen of Arcadia My address is 1276 Oakglen. It's
safe to say that none of us here want to pay any more in taxes than are necessary. It's
also safe to say that none of the members of this Council want to request a tax
assessment unless they have run out of options, unless they have run out of options to
solve our city's fisca1 problems,
The question that we're being asked to decide on in several weeks is whether we're
willing to tax ourselves SI22 per year, 33 cents a day, to maintain our current level of
services. Let's be honest with each other. Ifwe do nothing, the expected budget deficit
for this year will be approximately S1.5 million. And next year, we're talking about S2
million. The problem is not going to go away, The problem is only going to get bigger.
The problem is not a new one, It's a problem we've been facing for five or six years.
12
VINCENT FOLEY
When will we have to look at the 10-year trend for our primary sources of revenue,
property taxes, utility taxes, sales taxes, hotel taxes, to see that our tax revenue has been
flat or down. Added to this problem is that lower property values in Southern
California, the lower sales taxes in California or here in Arcadia have taken a toll on
what the city receives. The State of California, several years ago, decided to modify the
proration rate on the amount of property taxes that cities get The consequence has
been, as we've heard tonight, that we lose approximately S2 million in money that we
used to receive.
On the expense side of our budget equation, our Council has frozen the hiring of new
personnel, they've actually terminated staff. Some staff have gone without salary
increases for a number of years. We've reduced services. And where appropriate, our
Council has made the decision to outsource services in order to save money. Being an
elected member of this City Council has been a hard job for the last six years, and
frankly, we should commend them for the efforts they have taken to provide us with a
level of services with a diminishing amount of resources.
I've actually taken the time over the years to look at the details of the budget Our
Council and our city staff have worked hard on our behalf. I'm comfortable with the
integrity of the people we have elected to represent and serve us, We're at a point today
where there are no other quick solutions to our problems beyond cutting services. I'm
sure none of us here have an interest in seeing a fire station closed in our neighborhood,
or diminished fire, or police, or library, or community center services.
I'm in the investment business, and I make a living by investing and making money for
other people. I do not like to give free investment advice, but in this case, it's easy. An
annual investment of SI22, 33 cents a day, is a good investment which will provide a
good return to those of us who live in the city and who own property in the city if it
helps us to maintain the quality of our police and fire services, our services to our
seniors, the maintenance of our parks for our youth, and the maintenance of our streets.
I think that if each one of us should take the time and think about the facts, what the
past budgets tell us, what the current budget tells us, and the risks that we take if we fail
to act coriectly, I think our decision should be to support the passage of this tax
assessment Thank you very much.
Good evening, members of the Council. My name is Vincent Foley and I live on
Cambridge Drive in oUr fair city of Arcadia. And I hope it remains the fair city of
Arcadia.
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I am not going to address my remarks tonight to you, the Council, but if I may I would
like to address the remarks to the audience and to the audience on television. Let me
assure you that I don't want to pay another SI22 a year in taxes. But I don't think
anybody sitting up there wants to pay another SI22 in taxes a year, and I don't think
anybody out there wants to pay another SI22. I haven't heard of anybody yet who is in
favor of paying more taxes. So let's all get that straight and understand that from the
get-go. Nobody wants to pay more taxes.'
I have nothing to gain by this Fire Suppression District vote passing, except that if I
have a heart attack at home, I know the Fire Department is going to get there on time.
Now the gentleman a few minutes ago, Mr. Farrell I believe, talked about the Fire
Department only going out on three fires a month or some gaIbage like that Obviously,
the man knows not of what he speaks. In fact, he said, standing right here, I know my
numbers are wrong, but then he went on and gave them anyway because he knew they
were inflammatory and he knew that people would pick up on those numbers.
Had he listened to a scaimer, he'd know that the Fire Department rolls out on every
automobile accident in the City of Arcadia. Every time a senior citizen slips and falls at
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Vons, the Fire Department roUs. Every time there is a senior stroke at one of the
retirement homes, the Fire Department rolls. And the fire truck. And the police. I've
got a scanner. I listen to it all day long. They're out constantly. So this garbag~ about
the Fire Department doing nothing but sitting around all day long is crap, and you know
it, Mr. Farrell, and I'm really ashamed of you for (inaudible).
And we're ta1king about the city budget which is short of funds.' This money is going to
keep our budget afloat People talk aboui Downtown 2000, I don't like Downtown
2000. I think it was a waste of money, But I don't think we can go out and tear up the
benches and the light standards and the concrete and give it back to somebody and get
our $8 million back.
Let's be reasonable. We have the budget today to deal with, and we have to go forward
from today. And I trust that the individuals sitting at this table, in front of me, if there
was any way in God's earth that they could avoid coming to the citizens with this tax
increase, they would do it And if any of you were sitting up there, or if I were sitting up
there, and there was any way we could avoid the tax increase, we would do it And
that's why I believe that this is the ouly thing that can be done at this point in time.
Now I've heard from Dr. Ellison ta1king about how terrible it is that we don't have any
Walmarts or Targets, where are they? I've heard Gino Roncelli mentioned tonight that
it's terrible that we're raising the taxes. Well, about two years ago, when Santa Anita
was ta1king about a development at the race track property, there was a public forum, In
that public forum, sponsofed by the Chamber of Commerce, was held at the Community
Center. And there were two sides of the "debate," The city and the side representing
Santa Anita and the development, and then the side representing anti-development
Gino Roncelli was on that panel, Mary Bruckner was on that panel, Frank Goddard was
on that panel, and I do believe that Dr. Ellison was on that panel. Opposing the
development at Santa Anita, And I remember a statement by Gino Roncelli who said,
"We don't need any development at Santa Anita. All we have to do is raise everybody's
taxes $150 a year, and we'll have the $2.4 million that the Santa Anita project is
supposed to come in, bring in," Well, there is no development at Santa Anita.
And if anybody needs to be reminded, there's only certain limited ways the city gets
money. Development, which brings in more sales revenue. Property taxes, which this
city can't do anything about, that's established by Prop 13. Or additional suppression
districts, assessments, -utility taxes, that's the only thing the city can do now.
Development which the city bas already talked about We don't want development, not
in this city. But many, many of the citizens in fact, many of the citizens right here in
this room tonight are the same citizens that have been coming to a public forum saying,
"We don't want any development We want Arcadia like it used to be,"
Well I want Arcadia like it used to be, too: a class city where I get responses, where I get
good services, where I get a great library, where I get good recreation, and I'm willing to
pay $122 a year more to get it Thank you.
MAYOR HARBICHf: Mr. Farrell, you've already spoken. And....
FARRELL:
MAYOR HARBICHf:
Since he addressed the audience, I feel compelled to respond.
I don't care if you feel compelled to respond or not, sir, but you've already been up there
for at least 10 minutes.
I support the assessment for three years, not 20 years.
My name is Paul Massier. I live at 1000 North First Avenue.
FARRELL:
PAUL MASSIER
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MAYOR HARBIClIT:
CmEF LA VOlE
MAYOR HARBICHT:
CLETE DEFIORI
When I moved here in 1956, City Council members did not get paid. We did not have a
City Manager. It's my understanding now that we have people in the administration
who make as much as the Governor of California, which I don't think is appropril,lte.
I'm also moderator of the Arcadia Congregational Church. The $122 that people have
spoken about appears to be maybe on the average, but this appears to have been an
attack on churches. Our church has been assessed more than 10 times that value, That,
I don't think is appropriate, That is 70% or more of the taxes that we now pay on that
property.
Also, my property happens to be divided into two parcels. Part of it is an easement
which the County Flood Control District owns, The assessment on that part is more
than the taxes I pay. So whoever figured out that distribution, I think, needs to go hack
to the drawing board. I think that's all I have to say about this.
As far as the Fire Department is concerned, I've been informed that not long ago, there
were four firemen assigned to each truck. Now there are three. And it is my
understanding that it takes two fire trucks to come to a fire to fight that fire, because
three men cannot handle all of the equipment that's necessary to do so. Also, on South
First Avenue, if we ever had a fire there, I think we would have a problem fighting that
fire. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Mr. Massier. Go ahead and have a seat I was going to ask the Fire Chief to
explain to us what response, what kind of response we do have, and maybe to clarify
some of this question about service calls. You can sit down, if you like. There's been a
number of questions about that Chief?
Thank you, Mayor. Two minutes in Firefighting 101. A single-family dwelling in the
City of Arcadia today, to be effective, to get knock-down on a fire before flashover,
which is when the whole contents of the inside of the structure flash at the same time,
requires 19 specific evolutions to take place, by 19 people, on a typical single-family
dwelling. In a residence in Arcadia, you don't get a fire engine, you get all the
resources we have that equal as close to 19 as we can. That's to be effective on a single-
family dwelling.
If one of those evolutions, be it the person on the roof that's opening a hole to let the
gases out so the firemen can go in the front door, etc., etc., if one of those evolutions
doesn't take place, it affects how we fight that fire, and whether it was successful or not
We have three fire stations. We have an average response time of three minutes. That
gives us those 19 people there in a reasonably fast period of time. That's how we're
effective.
You close down a fire station, you take one of those 19 people away, it affects how we
deliver fire protection, No questions asked. I'm telling you as the expert in fire hired by
the City of Arcadia to tell you that, based on a lot of years of experience. We have very
good fire protection services here.
I can't let this one comment go by. The fire protection system of Arcadia averages 13
runs a day. Thirteen runs a day. If you think you can get a good night's sleep averaging
13 runs a day, when all of the bells are going all night long, come and spend a night in
the fire station, because it don't work that way.
Anybody has any specific questions abOut fire protection, how the fire engines are used,
how the firemen fight fire, etc., you're welcome to come to my office any day. I'll be
glad to sit down with anybody, any time, to go over resource requirements. Thank you.
OK. is there anybody else that wishes to address the Council this evening?
Yes, my name is Clete Defiori and I live on El Monte Avenue.
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MAYOR HARBICHf:
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHf
DEFIORI
I'd like really more or less to the clarifications by Mike. In reading through the City of
Arcadia Fire Suppression District, I'll take this piece of it here, ta1ks about a budget of
$25 million. It says there is a major reduction in our revenue because of the realty Stale
taken away from us. It says, combined with declining property values, I have a qUestion
on that, in the 90's, significantly lower utility tax revenues due to deregulation, I have a
question on that, and the stagnant California economy.
Well, I've been in Arcadia now for about 35 years, 34 years, I have never seen as many
homes built as I see in the last ten years. You take down a $300,000 house and you put
down, you build two houses $800,000.$900,000. It seems to me that your tax base of
$400-$500 a year suddenly yields $8 to $15,000 a year. Now, with the hundreds of
homes going up in Arcadia, and the tax base changing from $500 to $10 or $15,000, it
would seem to me that mathematically you're talking about a big, big increase in taxes.
Now, would you like to address that, first of all.
Yes I would, Mr. Defiori. There's no question that in the 90's we've Seen some new
homes that replaces obviously less valuable homes. Most of the building you're talking
about came in the 80's. Home values in Arcadia are probably off 20-25% for existing
homes. Many people have had their homes assessed downward.
The other thing is, is that home sales have been fairly stagnant during the 90's. There
has been nowhere near the number of homes that have sold. And what's happened is,
during the 80's we had a lot of homes selling, The real estate market was very hot. Atid
we had homes that were under Prop 13 so they were valued for property tax purposes at
$70-$80,000 but they were worth $300-$400,000 because people had held for a long
period of time, so they were being taxed on the basis of $70-$80,000 value. When that
home sold, then it was ~as=sed at, say $350,000, and so we saw an increase in
assessment from that.
Because homes haven't been selling, we're not seeing those kinds of reassessments. We
are having people that are having their homes assessed downward, people who bought in
the late 80's, early 90's and have seen these 20-25% decreases in the value of their
home. I think it's right that they should have their homes m<-sed downward and pay
less property tax, but the fact is that, despite the fact that there have been obviously some
new homes built that have had significant increases in property values on that particular
piece of property, across the board, we have not seen the increases. And that, coupled
with the $2 million that the State took away each and every from us that we used to get
up until about five years ago, has really crippled our property tax revenues.
The other thing I might mention, just for clarification, that of every dollar you pay on
property taxes, about II cents comes to the City of Arcadia The vast majority of it goes
to other agencies, the County, the schools, and those kinds of things. So we don't see.
If the amount of property tax being paid by a property went from $1,000 to $5,000,
we're going to see an increase, but we don't see a $4,000 increase, we see 11% of that,
we get to see about a $440 increase, The County, the schools would see the rest of it
Well the bottom line, though, is the revenue from taxation on property is still up,
obviously it has to be. Because, you know, the area where I live, I mean, I can
see the homes being built there, I mean, just by , you're building a lot, a lot of
homes in South Arcadia, there's no question about it. And large, large homes. So I
would say that the tax base, or the tax revenue, or whatever the percentage is, has got to
be up, considerably, in the last seven or eight years.
I would say it may appear that way to you. But the facts are, it isn't
Well, I kind of find that hard to believe, but I'll go along with what you say. And you
know, I haven't noticed my property taxes going down, and like I said, I've been living
here for years. My property tax keeps going up, as you know, whatever the percentage
16
MAYOR HARBICHT:
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHT
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHr
DEFIORI:
MAYOR HARBICHT
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHT
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHT
is, it hasn't gone down. I wonder how many people's property taxes have been reduced.
Very very few that I know of.
A large number, sir.
A large number.
You have to go through a process where you apply to have your' property rp"oo~sed. and
the County Tax Assessor sends you a form, you fill it out, you put in some comparable
sales, you send it back, and in many cases they'll reassess you down $100,000 or
$200,000, depending on when you bought
Now this significantly lower utility tax revenue. Has the percentage of the utility tax
change somewhat that I am not aware of! It seems like it's still a 5% city utility tax. I
don't see any changes. At least I haven't noticed any change.
There hasn't been any change. The 5% is constant It used to be 7%. Years ago, it was
lowered to 50/.. It has been 5%. What's happened is that utility rates have gone down
with deregulation and in anticipation of deregulation.
They have? Oh, I've gotten those for 34 years and I'd like to see one of those that has
gone down. Utility bills in the last 34 years, and I have every one of them.
You people are going on impressions and saying, "Gee, it doesn't seem that mine has
gone down" where we can show you the numbers. We know what we get. And I would
be foolish to say they've gone down if they've gone up. I can see the numbers. You can
come see Jim Dale, our finance person,
If you don't mind, I have a whole boxful of bills, I'll bring them all with me when I
come.
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Sir, unfortunately, your bill is not necessarily reflective of what the entire city is paying.
There's commercial and industrial which is seeing even more significant reduction. It's
what those companies are going after, I can't say anything to you except that it has
decreased and this last year, it decreased even more than we thought it would.
Gosh, I wish I could enjoy some of the benefits of the decreases.
I realize that the California economy is stagnant, even though our President says we're
doing a great job here. ,Walking through the mall, the Santa Anita Mall, I've never seen
so many people in my life. I hope that some people are buying from the stores. But I
don't know how our revenue can possibly be down when the residency numbers are up,
first of all, and the mall seems to be doing great '
Yet, our revenues are down. Our taxes for utilities are down, which mine show up.
Revenues are down, I never saw more people ,in Arcadia, probably 10,000 more than
there were when I moved in. It just doesn't make any sense. And I think it was last
year that I read in the Arcadia newsletter where Arcadia was doing great financially.
And all of a sudden, this year, there was some kind of a transformation that took place
where we're broke.
If I might comment, sir. You're correct. The mall is doing well. Nordstrom came into
the mall I think three years ago, no, three-four years ago. That was a project the city
worked hand in hand with the owners of the mall to bring Nordstrom here. We
projected that should they come, we would see about $1 million a year increase in sales
tax revenue. And not just from Nordstrom, but a rising tide lifts all boats, and our
projection was it would help all of the stores in the mall. Our projection was correct.
We have seen fairly significant increases, about $1 million a year at the maIl, But for
the last couple of years, other than that, it's been essentially flat It has seen that bump.
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At the same time, we've had some things that are not quite as visible. We have an office
here in town that probably most people aren't even aware of, called Toyota Leasing.
Toyota Leasing writes the leases for all of the Toyota dealerships in the Los Angeles
area. And we were getting the sales tax revenue from those leases, It amounted to about
$600,000 a year. Two years ago or three years ago, the State Legislature, not content
with taking $2 million from us in property tax, passed a new ordinance that the sales taX
revenue would accrue to the community where the dealership was where the lease was
written. So we've lost about $600,000 a year in sales tax revenue from Toyota Leasing.
So, the mall, there' s no question. The mall was a good investment on the part of the city
and it's paying off for us, this latest thing, bringing Nordstrom in. We lost Toyota
Leasing, Foulger Ford's gone, Arcadia Lumber's closed: We've had a number of places
leave. These things, along with the stagnant California economy, has come together to
essentially, we're falling behind even in the sales tax area. We're not keeping pace with
inflation.
To me, it's kind of strange, because being an Arcadia resident for so long, and this is the
first time this has ever happened So it's a new thing for me.
MAYOR HARBIClIT I've been on this Council for a long time, and enjoyed a number of years where we had
surpluses every year, We built up our reserves to a very healthy level. We were able to
provide a very high level of services and put money aside for a rainy day. Well, the
rainy day is here. It's been here for the last six years.
While you may not have noticed it because we've managed to maintain services at a very
high level while tightening our belts, the fact is we've been struggling with this for six
years now. And this Council has recognized that we can no longer spend our reserve
funds and spend ourselves out of money to continue to provide the same level of service,
We needed a pennanent long-term fix.
Our reserve funds are still fairly substantial. We have about $3 I million in reserves,
But it was only a few short years ago we had $41 million in reserves, Not all of those
reserves are free for US to use. Some of them are in restricted reserves. We can't get at
those.
DEFIORI
But the fact is, you can only go along so long, spending your reserve funds. I feel that
the time has corne to get our fiscal house in order. And we're either going to do that, by
the citizens saying they're willing to pay an extra 33 cents a day to keep these services at
the level that they're at, or they're going to tell US no, they aren't willing to pay any
more, and we want you to bring the services in line with our income. And if that's what
we have to do, as I said, that's what we'll do.
Each person has to vote their conscience, what they want I encourage you to just
examine the thing and tell us what you want us to do and we'll do it
Is this something that is going to be widespread, you know? If Arcadia goes along with
this, is this going to happen to all the communities? Are we setting a pPeCedent for the
rest of the communities to follow?
MAYOR HARBICHT I don't know if there's a precedent I think everybody needs to keep in mind that this
not a tax that is going to go through unless you rise up in rebellion and stop it This is a
tax that is going to go through only is you approve it Prop 218 took out of our hands
the ability to raise revenues and said the citizens shall vote on whatever revenue
increases there are. So we are merely adhering to what all of us in California said last
November at the ballot box. that if you want to raise revenues, you go to the citizens,
and they'll give you permission to, or they won't give you permission to.
DEFIORI
DEFIORI You know, there are many people in this audience who are senior citizens that have
been in Arcadia for years, You know, $122 for a lot of these people is a good piece of
18
MAYOR HARBICHr
DEFIORI
MAYOR HARBICHr
DEFIORI
HAROLD ELLIS
MAYOR PRO TEM
GARY KOVACIC
CHIEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
KELLY
ELLIS
KELLY
ELLIS
their tax bill. Let's face it, so the increase is very .very great It may not be much per
person who is paying $10-$15,000 a year for taxes, but if you're paying $300-$400, I
$122 is considerable.
I agree with that I think all you can do is, like, when you make any kind of purchase, is
you have to look at its value relative to what it's going to coSl you and decide whether
you want to spend the money or not '
The people are locked into the homes now, I mean, they've been here for years.
They're probably going to stay.
I wish I was locked into a home where I was paying $300-$400 in taxes.
OK, thank you.
Harold Ellis, 1504 South Eighth Avenue. Interesting point Everybody is for
motherhood. Everybody is for a good Fire Department Everybody is for a good Police
Department, and everybody's for good paramedics. When we have tax problems come
up, it's typical that we pick on the Fire Department, we pick on the Police Department,
we pick on the paramedics, we close down the parks. Got to raise a little suspicion
there. If we were to change our Fire Department classification from a Class I Fire
Department to a Class 2 Fire Department, what would we suffer in the way of loss of
services, and how much would we save in dollars?
I've been handed the gavel. literally, so I guess I'm in charge.
Does the Chief have a response?
Typically, on that response, it would not affect residential occupancies going from a
Class I to a Class 2, It would affect commercial and industrial occupancies, The going
rate is approximately, and I can't say it categorically that it would be, but generally
speaking we're talking about 10% per point insurance premium savings for commercial
and industrial occupancies in the city,
The majority of the people in Arcadia, of course, are residential because we have
apparently not encouraged big commercial operations, we have not encouraged business
facilities that I can see a whole lot of. We've cut 16 people from our staff over the past
two, years. And my question is, and I'm not lIying to be smart here, does anybody really
miss them? If we cut a few more, what are the consequences going to be?
Yes, Mayor and CounCil. Yes, they are missed, number one. We've lost firefi!ihters,
we've lost police officer positions, we've lost engineers. We aren't providing the same
level of service. As City Manager, yes, we miss those people because we aren't doing
things we used to do, It's back to what the mayor says, level of service. We have cut
our services and yes they are missed.
I
Let me ask you another question, then. Is the level of service that we're receiving now
adequate to do thejob?
I think the issue is hack to the citizens. You're going to make that decision. We're now
at the breaking point of lowering it more than it ever has been before.
According to what I've heard here tonight, we've had six years where we've had this
budget problem. In the six years, apparently, we haven't made significant adjustment in
city policy or direction to encourage businesses, etc" to come in here to make up the
losses that we could surely have anticipated that we were going to suffer.
We knew a long time ago that all the automobile dealers were moving to the east. We
knew that Arcadia Lumber, a business that has been here for many, many years, I don't
know why they finally shut down, probably because of the influence of the Home Depot
in Monrovia, but yet we haven't encouraged any of this type of operation to come into
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Arcadia to make up the shortfall which we surely could have anticipated had we sat
down and thought about it a few y~ ago. I unde~d,that we have a cuirent shortfall
of $1.5-$2 million. And yet we're asking the citizens i~ cough up another $44 million
in total over a 20-year period Next year, or the yeai after, or maybe a few years down
the toad, with Some proper planning, we may not have a shortfall problem. But I can
assure you that the Council is not about to cancel out the Fire Suppression District and
return the money to the people. '" ,
So we're committing ourselves to a long-term commitment here by voting in favor of the
Suppression ,D~sirict; and ~':re n()t con)iiiiitin!louf~jves, toa stop-gap measure to get
us'ihrough ihe next four years uptil we C811 gei oUrselv~ back on our feet It's a long
term, it's going to be really painful.
-'I . :' " '
In my perroDaI case' the \il!'es #t'rm going to. have to,pay to the Suppression District
amount to 40% of my current taxes, which, ij; a pretty, pre.tty ~bstantial increase for a
person on a fixed Income. It amounts to $4800 over a 20~yeai' period. And with the
increases which will,eome every year, I think 'it will be well oVer $5,000 or $5,500 by
the time you get to the end of the 20 years. rm sure it will not terminate at the end of
the 20 year period '
The people of California voted in Proposition 13 as a measure to help protect those on
fixed incomes. People who have planned their lives, have their property, got their
property paid off, and now if we increase this tax, it's an immediately substimtial burden
upon them. And I really think that's unfair to the people who are struggling to get by.
Because everything else is increasing.
., ,
W'5 rellIly do~:! n~. ~."10~"j~p' 1ft p~ laJ>es ~tl t?P, o~ all of our other pr~blems,
Medical care IS gOing up, food IS gOing up, gasoline IS gOing up. You name It Our
pb~nai budgetS, we are goi;'g to have to adjll;sl sO thai W~l can give you more money to
operate the city. '
So,. my question is, why can't the city a,djusta little more, and maybe the people wiI! .
have, (0 adjust a liille bi~ bill I think you're,jlist asking for an outlandish amount of
money to make up a problem which may Ix: temporary, which may not be temporary.
However, this solution you are proposing is ceitain1y very permanent and probably
permanent from here until Doomsday.
I am opposed SJl!'cificaliy, very strungly, to the wprding, of the questions on the ballot
Either you're for maintaining the current tevel of ~rvi~ or you're opposed to
maintaining the current level pf services. , I a,n ript oPPosed to maintaining the current
level of services. I am opposed to paying more taxes. And I wasn't asked that question.
I wasn't asked the question, "Are you willing to commit $5,000 to the city over the next
20 years to help the city out of a bindr and that's not the question I was asked. Are you
opposed, or are you in favor ofmaintainilig the 'city services? Certainly, everybody is in
favor ofthal '
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Interesting.' In all of the material that I have been to l'CC!'!ve on the Fire Suppression
District, I have found absolutely no opposing views, No opposing views in the ballot
material. I asked'the clerk if there' Was going to"be anything, and she was not sure. She
did her very besNo answer my question, but she was unable to, for lack of information.
I feel that's very unfair. If we're going to put a vote to the people, the people should
have both sides of the story, not just one side of the story.
I have some numbers around here. I have some questions I want to ask. Is it correct, 61
persons in the Fire Department?
20
CHIEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
ClllEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
ClllEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
ClllEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
CHIEF LAVOIE
ELLIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
BOB GANTIIER
CHIEF LAVOIE
GANTIIER
My budget is based on over 80 people because part of my budget, the $8 million budget,
is dispatch capability, of which 13 people, we do dispatch for police and fire. That
comes out of the Fire Department budget
OK, I understand. What you're saying, then, is the Police Department should pay their
share.
I'
No comment
OK. Of these 80 people, how many of those people are what we would call workers,
service the fire trucks, when the fire truck rolls in, they're on the fire truck, versus how
many people are in supervisory capacity?
Our supervisory capacity in the Fire Department consists of 4 people, Everybody else is
on the line and all but one of those 4 people goes to every fire that we have, and that one
person is me. Sometimes, I don't make them all.
OK, I can understand that And I guess the other question I have is, is the current Fire
Department budget is about $8 million? Is that correct?
Correct, including dispatch.
How much is spent on dispatch?
Approximately a million dollars.
OK. Thank you.
OK, Mr. Ellis. I've been rather generous with the time here this evening. And I've
asked people at the beginning of the public meeting to please limit their comments to
five minutes, and I want to give everyone an opportunity to speak. But can I reiterate
that request, that you try to keep your comments to five minutes so that we can give
everybody a chance to be heard. Anybody else who'd like to address the Council?
My name is Bob Ganther. If I sound different, I don't have any teeth. I've been in
Arcadia since 1948. I've had several houses here, I've seen the city go downhill and
uphill at the same time.
I blame the City Council and the management for their problem right now. Because it is
their problem. They created it They squandered more money on this operation 2000,
which is an abortion, ,which our own Planning Commission told them not to bnild.
They blame everybody. They blame the taxpayers for putting through the bond issue on
the Library, and they have to pay it
They say that the race track attendance is down, so they're not making any more money
from the race track, when the race track, their own figures indicate, that 1995 they made
more money in 1995 than they have in their history of the race track. And they also
have about $11,000, about 11,000 cars coming in every day for their off-track betting.
They take in a million dollars a day. So the City of Arcadia should be getting more
money.
I think the City Council and the management should pick out their projects and have a
priority. You want to call that thing down there on First Street, which is an unsafe
mess, you want to call that a project that should take priority over the Police Department
or the Fire Department? I want to ask the Chief. Don't you have a mutual aid pact with
your Fire Department with other cities?
We certainly do.
Well then you don't have any problem in building another fire station. You don't have
to. You don't have a problem with manpower, because Monrovia built a new station on
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CHIEF LAVOIE
GANTHER
CHIEF LAVOIE
GANTHER
ClllEF LAVOIE
GANTHER
MAYOR HARBIClIT
GANTHER
MAYOR HARBIClIT
GANTHER
MAYOR HARBICHT
Peck Road. You have a County station on Rosemead. You have all these outside
agencies that will respond if you need them. Is that correct?
There's a time element that is part of the equation that is slipping your mind: They
can't get here in the 3-1/2 minutes that the rest of the crewS are, in effect, fighting the
fire. If it takes a crew from Monrovia or County or EI Monte ~-I 0-to-12 minutes to get
here, they're not part of that effective initial attack capability tliat we're talking about
I'm not losing my mind on that. Monrovia will take an extra two minutes to get here.
They're right on Peck Road, they're right outside the City of Arcadia border.
Depending on the location of the fire, if you can guarantee me where the fire is, I can
guarantee a good response.
No, but you do have a mutual aid pact with other cities. Even LA County would come
in if necessary. So you're not going to have any power with manpower, is what I'm
saying.
Any time ".
I know, I know, your set time there. I've even had a City Council member, one
especially, who told me it was the people's responsibility to be at these hearings prior to
that abortion down there, and it was their fault because they put it through,
Well you squandered about $9 million there, You gave away a million and a quarter to
a restaurant on Second Street Your Redevelopment Agent said to the same people right
here, you are the Redevelopment Agency. You sold that property for half of what it was
worth. Now you're talking about bringing in a hotel that offered you $2.2 million and
it's a $4.4 million piece of property, and you're considering giving that money away to
them? And don't tell me about the taxes that they will bring in. It's going to take many
years to make that up in taxes, Suppose that outfit went out of business. They could sell
that property for what it's really worth.
The Redevelopment Agency was not brought into being for being a confiscatory agency.
It was brought in to have public property, for public property purposes. And in light of
this stuff that they're doing right now, including redevelopment in Monrovia, they are
confiscating property and selling it to private owners and private businesses, which I
think is illegal. I think this whole".
Mr. Ganther, we have- enough problems just running Arcadia Don't bring MoOrovia
into it, please.
Well, I'm telling you they all do it
I don't care what they do.
Your Suppression District is, to me, absurd. A district is set up to have a certain
problem like lighting or water, and you pay for that, and as soon as it's paid for, it's off.
I doubt if that's what this is, This is double taxation, and I would question its legality.
And I would think anybody who votes for this crazy scheme here, and it's a scam, is
nuts,
Just to correct a couple of statements that were made by the previous speaker, Referred
to a bond issue for the Library. I'd like to pOint out that the Library was paid for by
money we had set aside for that purpose. We owe not one dollar on that There never
was a bond issue. It is not a drag on our General Fund.
With regard to the race track, we get nothing of course from the parking at the race
track. We get 1/3 of I % of the betting handle. We get a smaller part of the handle for
the off-track betting that takes place at Santa Anita, and our income from the race track
has gone from about $2.2 million a year to about $1.5 million a year.
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LARRYMETZ
MAYOR HARBICIIT
METZ
MAYOR HARBICIIT
METZ
MAYOR HARBICIIT
METZ
MAYOR HARBICIIT
Neither of those amounts of money impact the General Fund, because we've never put
that money into the General Fund. We've always put that money aside for facilities
replacement and capital improvement projects, and that is why we are able to do such
things as build the Library without incurring any bonded indebtedness. The city bas
never had bonded indebtedness. So I just wanted to make sure that the wrong
impression was not given by those incorrect statements. Someone else who wishes to
address the Council?
My name is Larry Metz. I live at 343 East Laurel Avenue, I'd like to make a correction
to one thing the last gentleman spoke of. He mentioned a new fire station on Peck Road
in Monrovia. They are building a new fire station, but they're not adding any personnel
to man that station, They're transferring existing personnel from their old station to the
new station.
I've got a question for the Council. Are you prepared, if this passes, to guarantee not to
cut existing services from existing levels they are now? According to the center
paragraph of this thing I received in the mail, you're reserving the right to make further
cuts even if this passes in fire, it says right here, that fire suppression services will be
provided by the city's own fire personnel, or any other public or private entity. So you
could pass this assessment, and then next year, we could be a County Fire Department,
with less personnel. You could hire private firefighters like Rural Metro or somebody,
and save a fortune, and the people are going to be paying for it, for 20 years regardless,
I'd like you to answer that question. Are you prepared to guarantee no cuts in services?
Sir, I e"plained how we got to this point, was because we were looking at cuts in
services that we had to make. And we had a real question in our mind as to whether the
people wanted those cuts in services. So we decided to put the question before the
people.
Speaking for myse\f personally, I certaiuly can't speak for the rest of the Council, I
personally plan to vote for this because I don't want cuts in services. I want to continue
to provide the same level of services that we have been providing. This will balance our
budget and give us a smaIl swplus, And it's my intention to, then, business as usual, I
want to continue to provide Class I fire services to this community, and I intend to.
And I have not heard in any of the discussions in the innumerable, numerous study
sessions we have had, _any member of the Council e"1>ress anything but that ~c
intention.
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Will the Council put it in writing, that they will not make cuts in personnel if this
passes?
No.
It appears that you want to have your cake and eat it, too. You want to be able to assess
the people. I understand, we need the funds to maintain the services. But you want to
have the funds, and still return, to have the right to cut services if you so desire.
It certainly wouldn't be a desire that we would have.
\fit's necessary, would that be beuer wording,
\fit's necessary, if the mall should burn down tomorrow, and we're without that revenue
for the next three years while it's rebuilt, then we're going to have to take a good hard
look at everything that we're doing, So I can't absolutely guarantee,
Ail I can do is give you my personal assurances that all of the time that I've served on
this City Council, this is my tenth year, I have tried to provide, and I think I've been
successful, the very highest level of services to this community. I live in this
community, And I'm proud of it And I'm happy to live here, and I think most of the
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METZ
MAYOR HARBICHT
METZ
CITY A TIORNEY
MILLER
METZ
MILLER
RICHARD HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
people in this community are happy to live here. And I think the level of fire service
thaI we provide, the level of police service, the libraJY, the recreation services, and on
down the line, the tree trimming, the beautifu1 community that we have, the 1le:autifu1
public filcilities, go a long way toward making this a wonderful community. Why would
I wanllO destroy thaI?
If you don't wanl to believe me, then don'l believe me. I'm nol putting something in
writing, because I don'l know how you could possibly compose it so that it would be
something that I would sign. So that's all I can say to you.
OK, well. I know thaI we have these good services: I'm a member of the Fire
Department. I've been here for 25 years, I don'l want 10 see the services cut What I
would like 10 see, if all the people are going to pay the assessment, that it be guaranleed
that they won't be cut And you people aren't willing to do that.
I've given you my personal assurance. That's all you're getting.
Put it in writing.
Let me just add something.
A City Council in any specific year can't really bind the future City Council, and I don't
think the citizens would want a City Council 10 limit their discretion as a government
body and the California Constitution has provided that you cannot bind the future City
Council. There's nothing the city could do to bind the discretion of a City Council five
years from now, or two years from now.
And I wanl to add one other thing. The 20 years keeps coming up. and all of that
That's in the engineer's report. There's nothing legally committing the assessment to
20 years. And the other thing is that the assessment can be terminated by future
Councils at any time. I just wanted to clarify that
Do you think that's very likely?
I'm just giving you what the legal requirements are, because I think there have been
some misapprehensions here. Thank you.
My name is Richard Harris. I live at 143 West Santa Anita Terrace, I'll try to make
this quick, because the meeting's getting long. And I want to speak 10 this matter of the
city voting on city-owned property. First, I need to clarify my understanding of the
voting procedure, My Wire and I have a single family residence. If this passes, we will
pay $122 assessment
That's correct.
We will caSt one vole for our property, bul thaI vote will be weighted, That's my
understanding, that il will be weighted based upon the amounl of the assessment.
Yes sir.
So if somebody was paying $244 as an example, their vole would be twice as strong as
our vole,
You are correct, yes.
I will use the Santa Anita Properties. I'm not picking on Santa Anita, bulthese are the
ones that came up in the meeting a few weeks ago when we were discussing this. The
mail will pay around $1200. Their vole will be Ien times as big as mine or any other
single family residence.
Yes.
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HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHr
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHr
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHr
HARRIS
MAYOR HARBICHT
HARRIS
JOHN D. CAMERON
MAYOR HARBICHT
The park, the race track will pay $4,000-something, Theirs is going to be 38 times, or
thereabouts, ours.
Yes.
It's lilY understanding that the city property will have the strongest vote in the city.
If we, in fact, decide to vote it
If it is voted. I urge you not to vote it And I do this, it is my understanding that every
vote being cast will be voted by a property owner who will pay an assessment
Yes sir.
The State property, Federal property, County property, the School Districts will not pay
any assessments. I assume they do not vote.
Yes, that's correct
To me, for the city to vote, when they are not paying an assessment, is wrong. Now,
legally it may be correct. I'm sure your legal counsel has told you that it is. But
mornlly, it's not right It just is not right for you to.
You people have been elected by us. You have hired the city administration to run our
city. You are now saying that you need more money to spend on things for the city, but
for you to vote on this, to take money from us to run the city, is wrong. Now you have
said repeatedly that it's up to the voters to tell you what they want done. Let US do it
Those who are in favor, the gentlemen here who are strongly in favor, and there are
many of them who will vote yes. Those who are against it, will vote no. And you will
be guided by that But it is wrong for the city to vote their properties in this matter.
ThaIlk you.
My IllUIle is John D. Camerou. I live in Monrovia. But I've owned property in Arcadia
since 1951. I bought property. They didn't teU me there wasn't any sewers, But after I
got signed up, I found out I had to pay for the sewers. I've seen Monrovia grow, The
kids went to high school in Monrovia
The City Ha1I was up on First Street I've seen the City Council build this building, a
new Fire Department, a new Library, a new police station, and all these improvements
and Arcadia has grown. It's a nice place to live, and I would like to live here, buH had
a chance to buy a bargaiu.
I feel that someplace along the way, the Arcadia Council hasn't looked forward enough
to see that these things are going to come up, and set aside money to take care of this.
And I feel that this property tax is a third of what I pay taxes on the property that I own.
It's rental, and they'll pay it It's not going to cost me anything. It runs for 20 years.
That's not going to affect me either. I'm 94. And I'm not going to pay it very' long.
It's just not in the cards. I feel that 20 years, when you look around at all these people, I
bet a lot of them won't make it 20 years, either.
And I think if you put this thing up for 10 years, or 5 years, with a chance of repeating if
it didn't. But I really think that the fault is right in the City Council, in not looking
forward enough and putting money away to take care.
If a city like Duarte can come out with a $4,000 surplus, and they don't have the big
houses, the million-dollar houses that are on the hill here. If they 'can do that, you
fellows can do it And I'm sure you can. But I'm going to vote against it Thank you.
Mr. Cameron, I'd like to compliment you. At 94 years of age, you do a heck of a job. I
don't agree with what you're saying, but I think you do a very fine job. Yes sir.
I
I
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I
I
I
DICK SCOlT
MAYOR HARBICHT
COUNCILMEMBER
KUHN
MAYOR PRO TEM
KOVACIC
MAYOR HARBICHT
My name is Dick Scott, I live on Santa Anita Terrace. I'm very disappointed, We
attended the meeting herea few weeks back, and I heard the same thing then. You have
put forth a proposition to the people, either support the Fire Suppression District, or
suffer the consequences, And there have been several people up here this evening who
have suggested that there are many other alternatives, none of which have been
discussed or proffered by the Council. And none of which have been responded to when
they have been brought up by the audience.
But one that one of your own Councilmen strongly recommended in one of the Council
meetings was the application of the straight increase in the utility tax. And you yourself
said a 2% increase in the utility tax would cover exactly what you're missing and what
you're trying to obtain through the district.
I can't understand why you have ignored that I understand what you told me once
before. You didn't want to have to put it to a vote in the next general election, because
that was putting it off. We've been putting this thing off for six years. You're trying to
saddle us with something for 20 years. We're talking about a nine-month difference
between this assessment district and a general election. I can't understand why you
have mled it out as a primary possibility for solving your problem.
Motion to close the public meeting?
So moved.
Second,
Motion and second to close the public meeting. Any objections, So ordered,
26